300 Series - Does it major on rhythmic drive?

So, after losing patience with the inability to listen to music at low 552DR volume from both speakers (dead right channel from volume imbalance) and the NAP500 DR struggling to keep its cool driving my current YG’s I found myself moving to another amplification brand.

This has brought major benefits, but has highlighted to me exactly what it is that makes recorded music so enjoyable? Having come to realize the fact that the usual metrics of sound description fall secondary for me to rhythmic drive and the sense of ‘being in the front of the musicians’ in terms of slam etc, can those with experience of the 300 series (amplification only) share their thoughts on how it delivers on PRaT and how this has evolved from the old classic components? I understand there has been a change to the overall sound signature, but is the boogie factor / musical drive still to the fore?

Thank you collectively for your experience ..

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@mij29 i am not exactly sure what you are asking. I have a 332/333/NVCTT/NC250/NPX300(2)/Spendor D7.2/P10?and have found a major increase in PRAT compared to my former SN3/NDX2/XPSDr/P9 system. I don’t have the 350 mono amps so it is not a complete series 300 system but it is close. If you decide to go with a 300 system, instant on, as opposed to system automation will yield better PRAT, I have found. YMMV.

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I’m also not sure what exactly is being asked.

I have a 300DR (classic series) and it has always worked great for music at all volume levels (low/med/concert) without balance issues, on both my Dynaudio Confidence C2 as well as the Dynaudio Contour Legacy I recently acquired to replaced them.

I’ve not ever heard the NC 300 series, and doubt I ever will. My next step is elsewhere.

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@JosquinDesPrez i am thinking the OP is looking for feedback on the 300 series PRAT ABILITIES. Mine is not a full 300 series b/c of my NC250, but I have most of it. Setup is important. I have found that instant on increases PRAT. That surprised me.

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Thank you for the replies, much appreciated.

It is indeed the PRaT and rhythmic drive of the new classics above all else (noise floor, dynamics, soundstage size etc) as this is the greatest arbiter of engagement and hence enjoyment I have found, for me and my musical enjoyment, presumably just the reason Julian Vereker started the Naim project right back in the first place. The NAP300dr is amazing; my mention of volume was the frankly bonkers usage of a volume pot that cannot play evenly at low volume on the 552 - I seriously struggle with how this can remain on sale today when this issue persists, regardless of how good it can sound when the volume is at more robust listening levels. My pot was replaced once for one measured to be much better by HQ but is was no different - the sound disappeared from the right speaker at low volume completely.

It’s the slam, rhythmic drive and pull-in I am interested in as regards the 300 series; I fully accept the inevitable criticism that I should have auditioned the 300 series before going with another brand, but all the OC wiring, boxes and limitations of outright current capability for my chosen speakers saw me overlook the obvious 332/350 I ought to have tried. I might be another music lover returning with his/her tail between their legs, accepting that engagement is important above all else and that, for me, comes from those old Naim virtues.. If other system configurations or brands deliver the same front-row experience, I’d love to be pointed in the right direction.. My greatest system experience came from a 282/ regular super cap/ 300dr into Dali Epicon 2’s, with Chord signature cabling throughout - rich, but lightning fast, with absolute infectious rhythm and spectacular results with top Vinyl source material and very very good with the CDX2/555dr I also had at the time. A blind, irreversible purchase of an ex-dem 552dr broke the synergy and the enjoyment, maybe it was too much detail and other HiFi metrics that came to the fore, and the engagement was lost.. Buyers remorse!

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Just a quick search and i see they present apparently a difficult load.

A review shows an Hegel 30a with them ( 1100 W/ 8 ohm), or associated d’Agostino monos.

Not sure the 350 will do much better vs the 500dr.

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The 500 is a bridged design so, while it performs wonderfully into a benign 6 or 8 ohm speaker, it’s not so good into low impedance loads. The old NAP300 used to be a better bet in such circumstances. I would guess that the NAP350s would be even better here than the old 300, short of going to statement monobloks.

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Hi mij29,

I briefly tried the NAP 350s with some amplifier crippling loudspeakers. In summary I did like the NAP 350 presentation. I have provided a link here to where my findings begin.

If you search ‘NAP 350’, you will also find other assessments which may answer your question on this thread.

However I have a few other ideas that you may wish to try as it seems you have already invested quite sufficient in HiFi equipment.

  1. How much exploration have you undertaken with adjusting position of loudspeakers in the room? My understanding is that YG Acoustics loudspeakers are designed to be somewhat flexible for placement and adjustments to toe-in can bring very big changes to listener perception.

  2. Following on from above have you got any acoustic room treatments in place?

  3. Having personally undertaken a deep scientific study over the last 12 months of loudspeaker cables - which includes the Siltech product that I think you have in your system - one quick try (if you have access to other cables) is to pick a brand and type such as Chord Sarum-T.

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Thank you so much for your ideas and I’ll bear all in mind.

The YG’s are indeed tolerant of placement and as they are completely sealed, their low end is wonderfully tight.

Thank you too for patching in such useful experience with the NAP350’s from various contributors. This was very useful - I particularly liked the ‘broadsword hitting flesh’ slam comparison, and wonder whether noise floor etc is a sensible trade-off. I understand how one system to the next is ultimately likely to major on certain genres rather than being a Jack of all trades as some with very diverse musical tastes like me would hope for.

I’m considering a chat with my wonderful dealer and see what he says…

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18 months ago I upgraded from 300DR to 350 mono blocks and it has been astonishing. I am only at 252 level and not 500 series but I did audition 552 with my 300DR and then went 252/350 and, tbh, there was very little difference to my ears. So 350 made a lot of sense. No regrets. At all.

They are fabulous power amps and drive my speakers with aplomb (and more power than they’ll ever need).

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Thanks Toon, that’s great to hear.

I’ll work out some time to go take a listen - should have done it ages ago!

I have run olive 82/250 for decades and upon its launch reviewed the 552 for HFN. I have also lived with the 252/SC/300DR system for 2-3 months very shortly before I reviewed the 333/332/350 for Soundstage Ultra. That 300 series review ended up running to over 10 000 words spread across various articles because I reviewed each component in turn.

I won’t even begin to regurgitate what I wrote here except to say I believe the Naim 300 series is a triumphant return to the drama, excitement, power and dynamics that made me fall in love with a Nait 1 in 1988. It is in my view the most beautifully designed, best technically executed, most engaging and most compelling series Naim has ever produced particularly when taking price into account.

Suffice to say that I am in the midst of upgrading to a full 300 series amplification system and it will be as far as I ever need to go. The sense of effortless power, dynamics and pace coupled with the kind of accuracy and tangibility that old naim olive could only dream of has made it impossible to live without it. Music in my home has never sounded so lifelike or given me goosebumps like that system did and I need it in my life.

I hope it’s OK if I quote a little of the conclusion to my NAP350 review:

Make no mistake, this is the most visually attractive series Naim Audio has ever launched, but it’s also very clear that the firm has advanced its state of the art sonically and ergonomically, too. I loved the way these NAP 350s managed to combine the firm’s traditional strengths of pace, rhythm, timing, and dynamics with newfound abilities in imaging, tangibility, and stage depth.

The NAP 350 fits into this new range perfectly, like Audrey Hepburn slipping on a cocktail dress—they’re made for each other. The NAP 350 has superb drive, impressive bandwidth, detail, and power, and is capable of maximizing the performance of any loudspeaker that you might care to use.

I love that the system’s remote control triggers its backlight as soon as you move it, and that it’s omnidirectional. I adore the feeling of reliability and solidity I get with Naim products: secure in the knowledge that even 20 years down the line, the firm will still be around and willing to service and support my equipment. In a world of disposable electronics, this kind of longevity is deeply reassuring.

Perhaps more importantly, this new range displays a little more of the mojo that characterized the earlier series of Naim amplification. When listening to this complete system, there was a visceral energy that I found highly addictive, capturing much of the thrill and energy of live music. This certainly isn’t an amplifier that will cosset you, or blunt the dynamics and impact of the original performance. For some, it might be a little too much; for others, it will be perfect, because it embodies everything that Naim has ever stood for.

This is an audio ecosystem that makes playing music exciting again, and will lead you to spend as much time in record shops or listening to music as you did when you were 16. You’ll sometimes arrive at work looking haggard after a late night spinning just a few more tracks. Your boss won’t like it, your bank manager won’t believe it, and your mother-in-law won’t understand it.

I can’t think of any better reasons for buying it. Turn on, tune in, drop out . . .

JonathanG

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I can’t answer your question, but it may be worth noting that PRaT is not clearly defined and seems to mean different things to different people (https://community.naimaudio.com/t/that-lovely-prat/34121/16; https://community.naimaudio.com/t/good-sound-how-much-do-i-need-to-spend/42290).

And on the subject of changing sound signature you might find this interesting: https://community.naimaudio.com/t/julians-legacy/45568/8 - and of course as you’ll know the 300 is one of Naim’s relatively recent and advanced amps, though development has continued further. The only way to know if it gives what you want will be to hear!

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350s (from 552) are wonderful into Shahinian Obelisks

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I can’t speak to the 350s because i have not heard them. A year ago i upgraded my olive 72/hc to the 332/nvc/300 into an olive 250. Sounds incredible. My goal was to match the old olive 52 which i preferred vs the OC preamps. Well it easily surpasses the 52. So much so that i am considering the NC250 to replace my olive 250. I have heard the NC250 multiple times and it is a killer. The involvement, speed, quietness, and sophistication of the sound are all just amazing.

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@JonathanG Every time I read about the 350s I feel i am missing something with my NC250, although my speakers are relatively efficient at 90 db. Things sound great and the NC250 is objectively doing fine. Getting the 350s would mean I either have to give up NPX300 power supplied or get new racks which I don’t want to do. My dealer says I do not need any upgrades. BTW, having the system set to instant on rather than auto standby makes a huge difference.

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The 350’s are amazing for sure and their ability to exert absolute control over the ATC’s even at very high levels is what makes them so genuinely astonishing. However, you are already enjoying all the other innovations that came with the latest range - lower noise floor, Naim’s latest output transistors and the more holographic and transparent presentation. Your NC250 is also massively more capable than my olive 250.

I must admit I haven’t compared the NC250 against the 350, but I can tell you the NPX300 made a big difference to the 332 so I certainly wouldn’t part with that!

Thanks for the tip re: instant on!

JonathanG

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Don’t stress about it @Jaybar , the biggest most powerful amp is not always the way to go.

The builder of my preamp has a video about just this. He says if you only need a tack hammer to do the job, a sledgehammer is no good.

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PRaT stands for Pace ,Rhythm and Timing.

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@JonathanG There are switches on the back of the 332, 350, and NVCTT (if you are using the NVCTT) that need to be set to instant on. From the factory, the switches are set to auto standby. Naim talks about instant on as producing the best sound. The trade off is electricity usage. The difference is not subtle, but it will take about 4-5 days to settle in, once you flip the switches. Naim is correct.

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