Advice please on my superuniti

You rip on your computer using something like dbpoweramp. You then fix the metadata and copy to the nas.

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Thank you!

Hoping my kind friends still around… also wondering if I should instead get a new vortexbox or audio store as they are now called. Had half an hour yesterday with the very lovely Martin on the new ones. He feels that the tagging software is much better than my old bliss, though my pet hate (two disc sets merging and giving interleaved results) is apparently still a Thing. Do others have any views on audio store? I am not sure my elderly pc will rip cds as well as a vortexbox would.

I agree and although they tell me it’s better, it will still be poor. They also tell me that the sound is better from a ripped cd than from a physical cd but I am sceptical to be honest. I can see a download could be better, but if I am ripping a cd that it can’t find on a database, how can it be better?

Vortex box say that their ripping compares the rip copy with the version on the databases and tidies it up.

A second question would be- given we have a good DAC inside the vortexbox, I have been recommended to try an audio lab CDT rather than a CD player. Is that right that the cdt would mean I was using a better DAC than if I used a CD player? I also use a m2tech digital audio interface between my superuniti and the vortexbox which I guess I could use between the cdt snd the superuniti?

Does this work?

I wouldn’t need a vortexbox unless I decided to do both. Mainly I am wondering whether higher resolution downloads of new recordings bought online are worth the money. But there is also the point made by those from vortexbox that the quality is better from a ripped copy than a physical cd. I am not sure if I agree.

This probably refers to the “Accurate Rip” process of reading the CD bits, computing something called a check-sum (sort of a digital fingerprint of the ripped file) and comparing your result with the results of all the other people who have ripped that CD… if they agree, it’s highly unlikely your new FLAC file has a ripping data error; if they don’t agree, the ripper can try try again (sometimes going more slowly, sometimes re-reading a sector several times to ensure it gets the same data more than once). Lots of ripping software has this feature / functionality, not just whatever one vortexbox is using. It needn’t be your deciding criterion.

Note that this online checksum database has almost nothing to do with the online database for the metadata (track info, names, numbers, composers, whatever)… apart from using the same embedded CD identifier number so that they can look up the correct disc. The checksum is a sort of consensus value built up from many users. The metadata values are sometimes supplied by the record label, individual users, or a curation service.

If you enjoy listening to classical music more when the metadata is correct, convenient to read, aligned with your own personal expectations - and who doesn’t?! - then one option is to choose a ripping application for your pc or Mac and ensure that you review the suggestions from whatever database metadata are what you’d like. Get in the habit of editing your metadata - including the all important “multi-disc set” checkbox and the equally important “disc x of y” fields - before you hit the “rip now” button. It adds a few moments to the rip process, but saves time and frustration later when searching or playing.

If you have a lot of rips with bad (or just plain silly, thanks to your friends!) metadata, get in the habit of noting this when you play it and then opening that album in the metadata editor of your choice and correcting it as best you can - either by typing in the info from the booklet, of by re-looking up the suggestions from an online database (then checking and editing manually as required).

You’ll need to figure out a way to make this fun or at least somewhat satisfying as well as convenient and familiar … so I don’t suggest sitting down for a month and slogging through it all in one huge painful go! Take your time, fix things as you notice them, try different software to see the differences in real life, don’t be afraid because there is nothing to break!

Start by making a fresh copy of your existing directory of all your ripped discs, and work on editing that new copy; try different metadata or tag editors to see how they work and see what you like and dislike about them. Or start by taking your twenty favourite but problematic CDs and make new rips, with new and improved metadata, using one or two or five different ripping engine applications to see which one you like using. Or start by installing several different UPnP servers on your computer, and pointing them all at your existing music directory, then choose them one by one in the Naim app (under “servers”) to learn how the different presentations look.

Then pick what you like and keep going with that ripper / editor / server.

The pro of a turn-key solution - like vortexbox, Naim Core, Roon Core with a usb CD-ROM, or any other integrated hardware / software solution where you insert the CD and walk away - is that it’s quick and easy. The con, of course, is that if you don’t like what it gives you then your options are limited (often “very very limited indeed”).

TL;DR: pick anything, try it out to see how it works and get familiar with a slightly longer workflow… then decide if the extra effort and short learning curve gets you sufficiently close to what you want in the long term (your version of perfect metadata) to make it worthwhile for you to spend that extra time and effort.

Best wishes with your next steps!

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Thank you! That makes a lot of sense. I suspect that almost nobody but me is ripping some of the really problematic discs… I will take this away and do as you suggest, though it may have to be a project for when I have a bit more time. Meanwhile I think I start with a CDT to supplement the fact that my dear old vortexbox won’t rip any longer.

I’m not sure which problem - metadata errors (leading to bad experience while browsing and selecting your music) or checksum errors (indicative of bad data in your rip and leading to unpleasant noise or gaps while playing your music).

If it’s all about the metadata, and you still have the cd and its booklet, then you will really need to learn how to use a tag editor to fix it up.

That is certainly one way to go, and connecting the transport directly to the appropriate coax or optical digital input on your SuperUniti is easy and works great.

The other way to go is to download any cd ripping software to your computer and rip the CDs yourself manually, then copy the resulting files to a sub-directory in your Vortexbox music folder.

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It’s the metadata and just getting either endless unknown discs or junk info. I have been editing it with bliss before which was clunky but ok, but the software is out of support on the vortexbox so unless I get a new one I will have to bite the bullet, buy a new NAS, and try out some tagging methods as you say.

I am never likely to listen to much other than classical, and the most tricky discs are either too old or too obscure to be in databases. Also I care about multiple aspects of a performance and I have - like many ppl- lots of versions of works so I agree, if I am going to get back to streaming then I need bespoke. In many ways I could just forget it and use a CD player. I’m not quite sure why I don’t except that I do enjoy the streaming convenience of hopping around the collection.

Do you rate the Audiolab 6000? Many ppl do seem to.

That is, the Audiolab 6000 cdt transport

Yes, got it… and imho this is among the more important conclusions you have reached since starting this thread. “Back in the day” before auto-lookup, and way before turn-key, you had to type everything in anyway… so you definitely need a solution that makes the typing and data entry easy.

Are you on Mac or PC? Some of the “preferred” solutions for both ripping and tag editing are different (mainly because each is only offered on one or the other platform). XLD and MP3Tag being classic examples…

Asset / dBPowerAmp is available for lots of operating systems (including Linux derivatives found on NAS boxes) and many people on the forum use it (although I haven’t used it, or at least not since its earliest versions a million years ago). You might want to start there if for no other reason than easy access to help!

You don’t need to get the NAS to get started, or for the ripping and/or tag editing… if your vortexbox is still working as a UPnP server, you can keep using it for that. But everything - ripping, serving, tag editing - can be done from your home computer. Even if you use a laptop, you can get it all going, and try everything out… you can defer the NAS purchase until you want to “cut the cord” on having your laptop always on for serving music. If you have other reasons to get a NAS, like file storage, or backups, or whatever else, then of course get one sooner than later… but it is by no means a necessity for what you’re up to now.

I have no idea, sorry! EDIT: but frankly, I’m sure it’s awesome enough to enjoy and love!

With the SuperUniti, I used intranet streaming with Twonky installed on an early iOmega home NAS. Then Spotify. Then Tidal. Since I have a late 2012 Mac mini, with optical SPDIF out, I also had a bunch of fun putting various things on it, including an early look at Roon.

Now I have a Nova and Tidal and Roon. I almost never listen to my ripped content (it is served over UPNP from a Synology NAS running the old version of Minim, and available over Roon from my Roon Rock Core server, a simple possibly 8th or 7th gen core i3 NUC which is truly a set-and-forget network appliance).

At this point, and setting aside your deep collection of (obscure?) recordings, you might want to take a look at how Roon presents classical music. They have improved searching by composer, work, etc. And they somehow group various movements from a single work as “sub-tracks”, so you can play a single “song” but hear all the component bits (I’m a bit new to classical, so this may show in my sophisticated language!).

It’s a bit of a thing to get a Roon-to-UPNP bridge going, but any SPDIF source computer would also allow you to try it out with your SuperUniti if that’s of interest.

I know it’s a whole other thing, but I think I recall you expressing interest in upgrading from SU to Nova, and Roon (with Qobuz, if available where you are) is a very popular solution to many things classical in terms of curation, selection, and the read-along experience while playing / listening

Sorry if I’m being too long-winded or digging new rabbit holes… but it’s easier to change your mind the day before you plunk down your cash for a new cd transport (or NAS, vortexbox, NUC, or whatever) than it is once you take something home!

I run a pc which is itself a tad eccentric as my son built it for me, but it seems to be fine. I am not all that keen though on having it running whenever I want to play music. That means schlepping up to the home “office” (aka bedroom finally rejected by smallest child) when by that time if the day I am ready to ignore work.

I can find the files on the vortexbox on the squeeze box server so I can try some other copies and edits, and see how I go.

On the upgrade thing, it would need to wait a bit. But also I am unsure how much to invest in a streamed solution where I don’t own physical media, because providers change and walk away and content can be hard to get back. And if I buy the music on CD to avoid that, why am I streaming?

Originally it was space purely. Now I may have solved the space but I like my superuniti sound, so not keen to take a loss on what others have pointed out is a good amp.

On the “is streaming just more fun, more full if new ideas”? I think maybe yes, but for classical geeks the tagging pain outweighs the fun.

And yet… I sort of want to stream. It’s a puzzle and it has Kit to play with.

And this forum is part of it- you have all been so kind and it is all so interesting. I do love a nice rabbit hole.

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Totally agree. I bought a turntable earlier this year… why? Fun.

Sorting out your intranet / home streaming is super important for you. Getting that right is only complicated by the need to choose a direction… and the corresponding need to learn enough about the pros and cons to make a good-enough next decision re: updating / replacing your vortexbox and your metadata.

Your existing vortexbox as a streamer will work fine even without bliss. Adding new cd rips or updating old metadata can be done using other tools since, essentially, it is playing the role of a NAS for you already: your files live there, and your UPnP server runs there.

Doing rips and correcting metadata on your home pc does indeed mean schlepping up to the home office. But it also means you can do a bit of upkeep in multi-tasking mode while working from home… pros and cons!

For you, and for now, I see Internet streaming (be it Qobuz, Tidal, Spotify, Amazon, Apple, or whatever) as a way to explore things before you buy and rip the CD. Your home intranet is simply taking the place of a physical CD transport. No problem. Any online service would be an “add on” to that mode of buying and listening. Only with experience and time playing about will you know whether it can or will “take over” from your physical library at home. No big deal, it doesn’t have to! Most of these subscriptions cost about the price of one CD per month, so it’s easy to justify / budget for if you decide not to purchase only one title that month… Or you may just set it aside after a while and stick with what you already know and do. You seem very educated in the music you chose, buy, and enjoy and so maybe a new external streaming service entirely superfluous for you. Who knows?! Finding out could be a small adventure of its own…

Job one is updating your existing ripped collection so that it doesn’t bug you with bad metadata every time you listen to it. If that has appeal, great! If not, get the cd transport and keep enjoying your music.

All best wishes. I’ve enjoyed chatting (but don’t wish to badger or over-recommend!). Let us know what you choose to try next!

Edit:

Very much this! It’s a very good amp indeed. Enjoy!!

Thank you so much! I will take this away snd chew it over- and no doubt come back for a chat once I have done some things! All the best!

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I also have a SuperUniti and for a long time used an Audiolab CD as a transport via coaxial. You don’t get any cd info on the SU screen. Just track numbers on the Audiolab screen. I traded in the Audiolab and got an Innuos Zen Mini 3, two years ago.

I would highly recommend you have a look at one. It’s a very quiet shoebox size storage/server and streamer that also has a cd slot for ripping CDs, and a user friendly interface for metadata entry/editing. So you won’t need a NAS or to run a PC in the background to use it.
But a tablet is recommended for the Innuos Sense App, although it also works in a web browser. So you can use any old laptop or PC/Mac as well. The Sense App integrates your ripped CDs as well as Qobuz, Tidal or both.

The Zen Mini 3 has coax output, so you can plug it into the SuperUniti digital input. If you want to use the Sense app to control it. Or you can connect it via Ethernet to the SuperUniti and use the Naim app/remote if you prefer.

The Zen box can also run Roon if you ever want to go that way.

Thank you Dom

The issue for me is whether it can handle classical music, especially older abs small label recordings. I used to enjoy my vortexbox but the editing isn’t suitable for my needs. Do you know what editing software it uses?

The new Innuos app Sense has been recently released. It was re-written from the ground up to be easier to use and I believe one of its features is how easy it is to rip and edit metadata. But I’ve not tried it yet myself. You should visit their website and have a look around. Or email the owner and ask him yourself about classical music metadata. he’s been quite helpful in answering customer’s questions and concern.

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Thank you! I will take a look

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