Allae tweeter replacement: huge disappointment

Hi-Fi Corner
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Hello All

Following a tweeter problem (out of order) on one of my Allae speakers, I decided to replace the pair. Since the Scanspeak D2008/851100 was unavailable, and not wanting to modify the flange of a new Scanspeak D2008/852100 tweeter, but rather wanting to try a pair of Hiquphon tweeters, I embarked on this adventure. The replacement was very easy.

However, after a few hours of listening, the enjoyment is still lacking. Yes, they work, but I no longer recognize my speakers: they lack life, bass, airiness, liveliness, and definition, and the sound is ā€œdullā€ (dark). Itā€™s the complete opposite of the Allaeā€™s character. On paper, the Hiquphon OW2-90s are supposed to be better than the Scanspeaks, but in reality, itā€™s quite the opposite. It makes music: itā€™s very textured, with a very dense, refined, and precise midrange, but the soundstage is barely higher than the speakers and wedged between the two towers. The listening experience is bland, lifeless, flat, and linear. Nothing extends or rises in the treble. Have any of you experienced this with these replacements?

Iā€™m frankly disappointed because these Hiquphon speakers cost me an arm and a leg! And Iā€™m going to have to resell them and buy Scanspeak D2008/852100s, which Iā€™ll modify for installation (drilling additional holes).

Finally, I blamed the solder used, saying it wasnā€™t suitable, but I donā€™t believe that because when I desoldered them, I cleaned everything and soldered with leaded solder, just like they did back in the Allae days.

So there you have it, my disappointed feedback, because I still havenā€™t recaptured the lively, playful, and slightly carefree character of my beloved Allae speakers. Thank you for your feedback.

Luc From France

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The tweeters are brand new. Give them a week and see how they sound then. Presumably they are compatible with the Allaes crossover.

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That sounds immensely frustrating. I was going to ask if maybe they needed some burn in time, but obviously you felt things were too hopeless to stick with it. Hopefully the Scanspeak replacements go well.

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As HH says, give them some burn in time, theyā€™ll likely become free-er moving when theyā€™ve had some decent use. When I bought my Totem Mani-2ā€™s the blurb said to allow 6 months for burn in and that theyā€™d continue to improve after that too - and they did.

I find the TQ burn in disc is a good workout for speakers and I use it when the system has been powered down for a couple of weeks to help wake it up again.

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I find it hard to believe that the HQ are not at least acceptable sounding.

It almost sounds like the tweeters are not working at all, and you are listening to the mid-bass drivers by themselves.
If by some remote chance, they are both not working then check the DC resistances of each to make sure they are not open.
Also maybe by removing the old tweeters, you yanked the leads that are attached to the xo and are not getting an electrical circuit from the xo.

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I replaced the tweeters in my Keilidhs with hiquphons and they were transformed. I would say they probably needed about 40hrs to come on song but after about 100hrs they were amazing.

Also, Iā€™d check the silly things like the phase and whether anything was disturbed but youā€™ve probably done this.

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As others have said, Iā€™d give them more time..

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Iā€™m not surprised,the Hiquphon is very different sounding from Scanspeak,there is a reason that Naim did use Scanspeak.

Early Linn speakers was also equipped with Scanspeak and those are the ones,that Naimes use to prefer .

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The tweeters have over thirty hours of use. Compared to the first hour of listening, they havenā€™t changed much, if at all. Theyā€™re working well, producing sound thatā€™s more noticeable than before because their sensitivity is 1dB higher than the Scanspeak tweeters. The sound of the Allae tweeters is still dull, lacking a wide soundstage in the high frequencies, with recessed bass. Everything seems compressed (both the soundstage and the listening experience). Itā€™s heavy and not as lively and bright as before.

I was warned that the Hiquphon tweeters were darker and not necessarily suitable as replacements for the Scanspeak D2008s.
The technical specifications are almost identical to the Scanspeak tweeters, but not sufficient to make them a good original replacement. The increased sensitivity (in dB), the resonant frequency, the impedances, etc., probably donā€™t match the crossover frequencies of the speakers. The Allaeā€™s crossover was tuned with Scanspeak, not with Hiquphon. This incompatibility limits or restricts the speakerā€™s performance and also creates a general imbalance in the musical reproduction.

Linn uses Hiquphon for its tweeters, so replacing them is less of a problem because the crossover was designed for them, I believe. For Naim, itā€™s a different story!

If anyone here has any leads on where to find D2008/851100 drivers, Iā€™d be grateful.

Or how to adapt D2008/852100 drivers to Allae speakers.

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Itā€™s almost as if the Hiquphon speakers have completely drained the treble, bass, and dynamics, leaving only a flat and lifeless midrange. The Allae speakers, with their slight hint of warmth in the lower midrange, sound flat and dry.

By comparison, even an SL2 (known for being flat and dry) is rounder and has more presence! And an intro sounds betterā€¦ :sob:

Yet, you can tell the Hiquphon speakers are good because they have a lot of body, texture, and smoothness, more so than the Scanspeak speakers, but these qualities arenā€™t enough to overcome these disappointments.

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Something sounds very wrong there - bass gone after just changing tweeter? If it has affected the bass, have you properly fitted the twitter with sealing around it so there are no air leaks? But it all makes me wonder if you have done anything with the crossover, if so what?

If if it was me, I would use REW (free) software and a measuring microphone (the one they recommend is inexpensive especially if you buy secondhand, and if you have no further use for it you can sell on afterwards at minimal net cost), and measure the speakerā€™s output to see what it is doing.

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I simply replaced it with the exact same part. And I didnā€™t touch the crossover.

Youā€™re talking about the sealing gasket. The one between the tweeterā€™s outer cup and the mounting plate? Yes, itā€™s back in place. And its absence, I donā€™t think, is the main cause of all this trouble.

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Is there any possibility the phase on the tweeter has become reversed?

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The sealing gasket? The Hylomar adhesive bead? How might the latter affect the sound reproduction? I canā€™t remember if I installed it. But in any case, its absence doesnā€™t prevent the tweeter cavity from not being perfectly sealed due to the tweeterā€™s blade mounting plate and the rubber pads on which this plate rests.

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Another point to consider:

:white_check_mark:Iā€™m wondering if the tweeter mounting plate is under too much stress. I had a lot of trouble pushing the tweeter back into its housing. The cables are very stiff and difficult to push back in. Even with the screws tightened only minimally, the plate is under stress.

:white_check_mark:Did I clean the old solder off the cables thoroughly enough? I think so. Incompatibility? I used lead solder, just like in the old days. So, I donā€™t think thereā€™s a problem.

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I donā€™t know the construction of the Allaes, but if poor sealing results in air leakage from the bass cavity then that could affect bass. But that wouldnā€™t explain the top end issue. You didnā€™t respond re crossover?

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I havenā€™t modified the filtrer. All is like the origin.

Allae are built like intros, credos, sbl with decoupled speaker boxes with PIPs. The bass cave isnā€™t 100% sealed.

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Who said these Hiquphon tweeters are a ā€˜drop inā€™ replacement for the Scanspeaks.
Personally I doubt it, they may be a close match, but I suspect some fine tuning of caps and resister values is needed. Also you should check for tweeter/woofer phase integration.

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Exactly ,they are not a replacement for Scanspeak

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