VERY ASTUTE of you Mark indeed solder joints break in audibly and you are even exact
on the 6-8 hour time period! Be aware all solder brands sound radically different even if they
are the same 60/40 spec.
Thanks for the reply. I am glad that it wasn’t my ears playing tricks on me!
What possible evidence could there be to back up this assertion.
Easy, just re-solder everything with a different brand and do a blind test
This tells me you haven’t done much soldering….
This aside, I’ve often wondered how much of a compromise solder places on a circuit. All that money and effort into using gold PCBs, oxygen free copper, silver, etc, and we stick a layer of solder between it all.
Exactly! I can tell you from experience that quality solder joints make a difference. Not a big one. But still at the level we are talking about it is audible.
There has certainly been effort going into different solder methods and PCB mounting in general. Given Naim’s attention to detail, I am quite sure they made tests and have this covered
I’ve been doing hobby electronics for about 40 years. Admittedly, I’m still using the roll of solder I bought, I dunno, 30 years ago. So it’ll have lead. I appreciate there is a difference between lead-based and lead-free solder (I don’t find the latter as yeas to work with, but I’ve not made much effort).
Come on, the idea that two brands of solder of the same makeup can sound radically different is preposterous. (There’s a solid chance that the different brands are actually the same product from the same manufacturer, just with different brand names!)
I am of the assumption that your ears can tell you things that measuring equipment can’t. You could probably find two different speakers that measure the same but sound very different to our ears.
I suspect an audible difference, if any, is more to do with factors like the extent of any direct contact between the joined components beneath the solder and the quality of the solder joint itself, which of course potentially could be slightly different every tine with the same solder, so impossible to tell if the different solder is the determining factor in any audible difference if there is one. And as you suggest, it could well be that the precise same solder is marketed under more than one brand name.
Indeed, but that’s not the same as the comment I responded to. A manky solder joint will not transmit the electric current as well in any circuit.
But that’s a quite different statement from saying that solder brands have radically different impacts on sound reproduction.
Our vet has recommended we take our dog to the dog physio. Yes, a dog physio. Something I had never previously contemplated. So there’s always room for esoteric jobs I guess. Perhaps we will see the rise of a solderier in the world of Hi-Fi.
There seems to be a bit of a miscommunication going on. @anon39880737 commented on a radical difference,
You wrote about a small one,
Different, yes. But ‘very’ different, no, I think that’s where we differ.
Hi-Fi is stuffed full of hyperbolic statements such as a change having a radical impact, huge difference, night and day, etc. I accept that as one becomes more experienced, one probably becomes more skilled at identifying differences. (Equally, one gets older and loses hearing. But I digress.) But the reality is that most changes are incremental if even perceptible.
Today, our local dealer asked how the Vertere Technomat that I’ve recently added to my MG-1 was sounding. In truth, I have no idea. The system sounds fabulous and, if pressed, I’d say sounds clearer and more involving. But most likely it’s just confirmation bias, or me wanting to make him happy about selling it!
Like I said, the differences aren’t big. They are sometimes barely audible. But everything counts. I tend to just trust my ears and not assume. If people can hear a difference with their amp on a glass shelf resting on ball bearings then why would you refuse to think that something right there in the signal path will not make a difference… I am not saying I have heard it with different solder brands. Only fresh joints. I just use a decent solder with a silver content as it makes me feel better. But I won’t deny it might make a difference.
Go and have a look around the internet at speaker measurements. Have a think about how you think it translates to how they actually sound. You will see that all speakers are a variation of the same plot on a graph yet they all sound quite different.
The italicized part is not really true, but I do agree that two speakers with very similar plots can still sound very different. And even amps can, for instance.
However this is about speakers and not about soldering, and as mentioned it does not look like @anon39880737 disagrees about the possibility of the small differences that you mentioned for soldering
It of course depends on what measurements are made, how conducted, and how presented! Quoted measurements can hide quite significant differences in the nominal parameters measured, while there are many factors that can affect the sound that are rarely mentioned when measurements are stated. I think that the potential variability between joints of the same things made using solder is far less, with fewer, much less significant differences in terms of sound, assuming no fundamental fault like a dry joint.
Everybody has very valid points… I like this forum. I have had a week away and then hop on and am immediately finding myself in a debate about solder! It’s like an escape from reality!
Dog physio… well I never!!