From what I have read online, the uplift in SQ while streaming Tidal or Qobuz with the Innous Zen servers is due to Roon+SqueezeLite caching the tracks in RAM before playing them. I don’t think it’s anything to do with it being sending over Coaxial.
I didn’t notice any difference when using the Zen as UPnP server or as a Renderer via Coaxial to the SuperUniti. I’ve not tried the USB out as the SU doesn’t have USB input.
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Ok thanks.
I’ve also seen people saying that the process of converting to spdif unpacks flac files into a stream of pcm data, and that can help some streamer/dacs to do less processing and thus generate less noise.
Roon only sends PCM data out to any endpoint or DAC,all processing is done via the Roon core to do this endpoints don’t need to do anything.
Ah, yes, thanks CG.
I was thinking of a case where someone is using a USB to SPDIF converter, or sending out spdif from a ZM from locally stored FLAC files, not intermediated by Roon.
So innuos has been slow in getting my ordered Zen Mini 3 to my dealer. And while I wait I’ve been thinking whether I should just go straight for the Zen mk3 instead?
I will be using it via Ethernet to my SuperUniti and was wondering if anyone here has tried the zen range as a server only, with noticeable improvement to the sound quality.
I will have a chance to demo the LPSU with the mini, but not sure if it or the zen will make a difference when using these as server only.
I certainly wouldn’t do that without a demo. Even then, I would be thinking about where else I could spend that sort of money to get perhaps bigger improvements, but that would depend on where you want to take your system.
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But did you say above that the ZM didn’t improve SQ as a server compared to your NAS?
It only improved SQ as a Roon core and endpoint?
I doubt that anyone can say for sure whether the Zen would give better SQ than that in your system - only a test will tell you this.
There are other threads on Innuous with lots of tests and reports and ideas…
Were you testing Roon on the ZM on a free trial?
I was considering getting a ZM as a ‘posh NAS’, but it’s interesting that it didn’t sound any better than a QNAP as a NAS.
That definitely puts me off getting one.
@JimDog I didn’t notice a difference in SQ using it as a server only, but That was without the LPSU, which every review says improves it. That’s why I was wondering if anyone else could tell me, while I wait for my demo unit. I did use a trial of Roon where the zen was the core and endpoint. In this setup I used the Spdif Coax. Which to me, did lift the sound a bit. I know that there is an improvement when using the other connections, but I’m mostly interested in the Ethernet, which would be what I’d like to use most often.
@ChrisSU You are right, what ever I do end up with I’m definitely going to audition first. I was just curious if anyone out there has already compared the zen and zen mini as server only. As for other improvements, I wish I could, but budget and living space doesn’t allow me to get anything else worth while. Although I’m looking to demo the Chord Qutest when I get the Zen Mini just to see what it could bring to the table. Speakers are Kudos X2s which I’m happy with, and can’t go any bigger anyway.
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If you’re going to use a separate DAC, I would trade the Superuniti in for an amp rather than waste the entire digital side of the SU. A Nait XS2 would drive your speakers, and you might even make a small profit if you sell the SU, or get a Supernait 2 for a little more.
That is a good option. A Supernait 2 or Nait XS3 with the chord DAC is something I have been pondering.
What’s stopping me at the moment, in making that switch, is that my family use the system as well. and they all use the remote to stream internet radio and uPnp. It’s just so much easier for them to use the remote control then the apps.
Guess another option would be to save my money and trade in the SU for a Nova later on.
Yes, a Nova would be another option, or a separate streamer and integrated amp might not cost any more. If you are happy with the old streaming platform on the SU, the old ND5XS or NDX are real bargains now, or there’s the ND5XS2.
If you get a separate streamer, that keeps the door open to the option of trying a Chord DAC in future, without losing the Naim interface you are used to.
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Hi DomTom,
I remember your early frustration with the Atom and your choice to go with the SU based on more solid user experience (very true especially at the launch window) and better sound (still true probably, SU is all around upgrades relative to Atom, even though Atom was an improvement over Qute).
At this stage, and given the prices of the things you are looking at, it would really be worthwhile to look at the Nova: user experience and functionality has improved continually with firmware updates (and more features and fixes stated to be on the way in beta testing) and the Nova (for me and for most, but not all) is a really solid sound upgrade over the SU.
The remote issue could be your deal-breaker for family use, however. No problem to select and launch iRadio (particularly favourites) from front panel or remote control, but no possibility of doing the same for UPnP or Tidal - those are app only. On the other hand, Tidal and other streaming from familiar iPhones via Airplay or Chromecast or Bluetooth is easy and familiar, so family use need not suffer while they decide to get used to the new app or not.
I’m enjoying mine very much, and my wife uses the system a lot too. Lots of ways to skin this cat, but I do encourage you to revisit your original thinking from a couple of years ago given the maturation that has finally brought more expected performance online than at initial release.
Best wishes whichever way you go,
Regards alan
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Hi Alan, I appreciate the input and ideas. Something definitely for me to consider. I might start looking at Nova deals or at least what I could get for my SU as a trade-in.
But first I’d want to make sure I can get a good length home demo to make sure the sound quality, and also functionality is an improvement.
Absolutely, given that’s possible and (?) easy for you. I upgraded Qute and SU sight unseen: risky but paid off well and I’m content.
Similar thinking on your examination of upspec servers, I gather… and from my experience that’s even more worthwhile (and necessary) since not everyone hears the same uptick in performance, and there are a plethora of alternative approaches when you are not looking at a black box swap. The use of UPnP proxies to bridge Tidal, for example, seem very worthy on the old gen Uniti streaming platform but that buffering and interfacing limitation is one of many things improved on Nova and other second gen streamers. Most notice little or no difference between Tidal and local streams (barring source material effects of course). Admission: I’m in the skeptic camp, having heard little or no improvement from one server over another and not expecting to, but must also acknowledge that I have not done a demo on any of the really specialized units you are considering. Then again, I liked my Roon trial on Mac mini with optical in to SU and felt it was irrelevant that there is a 24/96 limit since my sources never got even that high (red book rips locally, whatever CD-or-nearly coming from Tidal). Many ways, many skins…
Good luck with next steps. You’ve had a really good run with your last decision, so stay patient and test everything that interests you before you make your next move!
Regards alan
@Bluesfan and anyone else with the Prestige 3…what do you think of it? It fits the bill for me of Roonifying my 272, but how does it sound - has anyone compared to other servers? What about options 'cos there are many of them!
Cheers
It will be difficult if not impossible to compare how it “sounds” with a Melco or Innuos or Nucleus with built in storage as there are so many other variables.
What I can say is that we eliminated anything by Melco because we needed the server to act a a Roon Core.
We then eliminated the benchmark (Innuos Zenith III) because of a combination of the weak processor capacity in case we wish to use Roon’s DSP, combined with price (seems to be about £1,000 more than other equivalent options).
This left Roon’s Nucleus or the Prestige 3 (in comparable spec). After a couple of long conversations with the delightful and eternally helpful Martin Smith of the Audiostore, we opted for the XL spec Prestige 3 and one of his opticalRendu Roon end points.
It has acquited itself very well with Chord and MSB dacs, plus Naim’s ND555.
We are really happy with it.
One final thought. There is real merit in buying your network streamer, server and network bits from as few vendors as possible. If you have a technical issue, fault finding is a nightmare and you really don’t want to be bounced between multiple vendors. We had an issue with a Chord box, yet Martin Smith was incredibly helpful when it came to fault finding.
Hope this helps, BF
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Thanks @Bluesfan (is that music or football)…that’s sort of where I am at and for the same reasons. I have spoken with Martin and was blown away with his knowledge. The Prestige seems like a reasonable cost option relative to its competitors too, and I could add a better power supply at a later date.
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