DNS woes

Streaming Audio
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Last week my Mac mini dropped off the network… (Audirvāna into Linn DS via UPNP, cabled via end of line EE8). Eventually after very much trial and error, updates etc a traced it down to the DNS settings not working with wired internet but fine with Wi-Fi. So I changed the DNS settings to 8.8.8.8 and its back on. However Audirvāna cant see the Linn as upnp. The Linn app works ok directly. You can’t set a manual DNS on the Linn, so I changed the hyper optic router DNS to 8.8.8.8 and dns.google as well. Restarted everything. Still no luck showing the Linn as an endpoint. Any suggestions? Haven’t been home at a time of day I can call hyperoptic and won’t be till week after next….

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Do you have any other network devices apart from the hyperoptic?

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No, but I did plug my laptop into the Ethernet socket and that works. Hyperoptic is a fibre to building, Ethernet to flat and to router system. You need a router as just stringing a switch into the incoming Ethernet doesn’t work unless for one device.

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I suppose you probably did, but just to be sure as I can’t figure it out from your post… Have you rebooted the Linn as well?

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Oh yes. Everything rebooted twice….

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You might be getting confused. Can I check first - the Linn UPnP is that on your local home network?

In which case that is nothing to do with what external DNS service you use, and will be down to your own local network. All DNS does is convert a URL (for home networks nearly always an external URL) to an IPv4 or IPv6 network address, like a big directory lookup.

There are special domain names for home networks such as .local addresses, that dont use DNS, but use a multicast broadcast to see who recognises that name. Devices and clients need to run a specific application to support that.

Not familiar with Linn UPnP, but standard UPnP uses another multicast discovery address technique to find the unicast address of home network devices… it does not usually use local host names for connectivity.

Settings on your home network can sometimes interfere with this discovery like a badly configured server firewall, or IGMP Snooping on a homework device not working properly etc. Some of things can break with bad software updates.

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Yes, it’s in my home network. All was working fine and then it suddenly stopped.

Set up was

Mac mini headless running Audirvāna, Linn on same network both wired. Control via Audirvāna app in iPad. Screen share to Mac mini from my MacBook if needed. All plug and play with automatic Ethernet settings. The app stopped working and screen sharing went off with no Mac mini seen. I took the mini to work as I don’t have a screen at home and updated it to the latest OS and checked the share settings etc. All good, but no help.

Tracing at home I found that my MacBook won’t load internet pages when connected to Ethernet but plugging it directly into the ‘wall socket’ avoiding the router works. Changing the DNS to 8.8.8.8 brings both the Mac mini and the MacBook back on line and screen sharing, loading internet pages. I then edited the DNS on the router to the same and that now works with the DNS set to auto on devices.

However the Linn doesn’t allow manual DNS and it’s not visible as a UPNP end point whatever the setting on the router or Mac mini. Strangely the Linn app on the iPad works fine and the Linn web based configuration works…..

So mightily confused and not an expert in this kind of thing…

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You can’t avoid a router. The router is a fundamental part of how you connect your local network to the internet.

You say your lap top works when plugging directly into the ‘ wall ‘ . What do you mean by this. Are you connecting directly to your fibre termination - in which case you Mac must be acting as your ISP endpoint router… which h may be possible , but sounds unusual.

Or are you running two routers?

Are you using the router as provided by your ISP. .. because that should be working or you simply contact your ISP to swap it out.

Do not use another router other than your ISP provided one - even as an additional router, because things get complicated very quickly and most domestic stuff will cause issues and problems as its not designed to work that way.

So confirm

a) You are using your ISP router, and only that. No double natting or any other horrors.

b)With your ISP router can other devices connect to your internet when connected to its wifi or ethernet port?

c)if your ISP router works on wifi and not ethernet or vice versa , do a factory reset on the router, if not get your ISP to send a replacement.

d)Your ISP might have undertaken a software update and it went slightly wrong with the router it has provided you..

DNS is usually and should be provided by the DHCP server . And so the DHCP server in the ISP provided router will be providing the correct DNS address it has been assigned (again using its DHCP query) from your ISP, but that has nothing to do with UPnP end point visibility - I think unfortunately you are conflating two different things.

There is a iOS application called LAN analyser - I think there is a basic version that is free, and it will scan your home network subnet - and will detect if a device is advertising itself as a UPnP end point - it puts a little ‘U’ to its address. so if on wifi connected phone and you run it on your wifi connected phone - then that shows the wifi path is identifying UPnP discovery endpoints.

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See above comments in line

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Does Audirvāna have permission to access the network on the device you are using it from (to allow it to discover the Linn).

DNS may be another issue as those are public DNS (google), so not used for your private network.

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Thanks - let us know how you get on with your ISP - that looks to be where the issue might lie - ie the ISP router.. but they will or should resolve given your use cases

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Thanks Simon and others for the advice. As usual there were several issues and I managed to trouble shoot and isolate them.

  1. DNS - setting 8.8.8.8, 8.8.4.4 on the router had resolved the internet site access issue, but nothing to do with UPNP.
  2. Audirvana advise having a switch and not the router between the source and the player. Put back a switch I had in that place before and have only one cable off the router now. Got working on my MacBook but couldn’t understand why the Mini wasn’t showing the Linn… (as all settings the same)
  3. Delved into Audirvana logging and debugging and noticed it said ‘no local internet access’ - so toggled that off and on again in privacy and hey presto!

So all back up and running… what a faf, but Audirvana does make a big difference in the SQ and the app is miles ahead of the Linn (and Naim) apps.

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Great! Enjoy the music! And I agree on Audirvāna making a big difference in SQ. I’m always amazed when comparing. That Naim still isn’t among the brands that are ‘Plays with Audirvāna’ certified is somewhat surprising to me as my ND5 XS 2 really does a marvellous job in my chain with Audirvāna.

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