Frustrated that I can't get all my streaming devices to show in Naim app

Hey all,

I have a total of 4 Naim streaming devices - 2 Muso 2nd Gen, 1 Muso QB 2nd Gen, and an NDX 2.

Normally I use Roon to solely control my NDX 2 in my main system and it is rock solid - Always showing up in Roon as an endpoint.

With the Muso/Qbs, I will generally use the Naim app because I am usually doing multi room streaming in the Naim app.

But it does not seem like I have ever had a time where all 4 streamers show up either in Roon or in the Naim app. For example today, I have one of the Muso 2 and the Muso QB and the NDX 2 in my Naim app. In Roon, I have the NDX 2 and the other Muso 2.

I can reboot the items, close out the app, try different iOS devices but always something seems to shift from one app to the other and they are never available at once.

Earlier today it was doubly frustrating as I had grouped my QB with one of my Muso 2s for multi room listening, then the Muso 2 disappeared so the QB was the only streamer in the app - but I couldn’t control it because it was “grouped” with the missing Muso 2!

Everything is a mix of wired and wifi - the NDX 2 and living room Muso 2 are always hardwired. The Kitchen QB and office Muso 2 are always wifi. But that doesn’t seem to matter as the app and Roon always show different combinations of all 4 so there’s no consistency with wired vs wireless.

Any ideas to get more consistent availability across all devices?

Can you temporarily move the qb and office muso so they are wired, then try the naim app plus roon again?

I can try that at some point but it’s not easily done right off the bat as I will need to locate/buy another ethernet cable. I can eventually hard-wire all the Muso 2s and NDX 2 but the Qb will always be wifi as long as its in my kitchen. Oddly enough it doesn’t seem to matter if it’s hard wired or not as to whether or not it appears or disappears from the app/Roon.

I’m just trying to rule out any issues with WiFi that might exist. The only thing is some issue with dhcp or ip addresses, are all these units on dhcp?ie no fixed IP address settings anywhere.

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I wish I could tell you… I have no idea about dhcp or ip addresses unfortunately. The weird thing is on some devices they appear and on others they do not. I have my iPhone with me right now and the Qb is on, but it is multi-channeled to the non-appearing Muso 2 so I have no way to pause the music or mute the volume etc. But if I walk to the next room and pick up my iPad they are appearing on the iPad app. And they never appear in Roon. I hate this kind of crap.

Do you have a single WiFi access point or router? Or a mesh system of multiple units that work as a seamless network across your house.
I’m wondering if your devices are split across 2.4 and 5 ghz WiFi networks, do you have both active? Sometimes especially when they share the same SSID your phone could be on 5ghz and a muso on 2.4 and something prevents them from talking to each other.

I use roon and I’ve never had missing units, but then mine are all wired to the same network.

Funny I have 4 Naim pieces on my network a mixture of old and new streaming platforms
Only 1 is cabled to the network plus the Core
Never have a issue so I really think a lot of people have network issues, perhaps over thinking the network
The systems are muso Qb 2 upstairs
Main system is in the basement ( but speakers on main floor ) and a first generation Muso in laundry area.

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Yes my living room Muso 2 is wired directly into the main Orbi base, which is wired directly into the cable modem right next to it. The NDX 2 is also wired into an Orbi satellite in my main listening room. The office Muso 2 and kitchen Qb2 are both wireless. So I am not sure if that has something to do with it. I should be able to see the wired units (the NDX2 and living room Muso 2) at ALL times I would think, because they are hardwired into my network, right? Wouldn’t the 2.4G/5G only matter for the wireless endpoints?

Your ndx2 is effectively on WiFi as it’s hanging off a WiFi extender/access point. I would also connect your muso direct into the router, but probably doesn’t make much difference. I don’t know if it’s possible but make sure the orbi network is using the same subnet as everything else, if that makes sense, ie everything has an ip of 192.168.1.(or 0).something. Where is roon running and how is that connected?

I’d start by making sure you set Static IP address’s for all audio stuff. Then assuming your 5ghz is strong to both units on WiFi make sure to only allow those devices on 5ghz. That should do it unless you have bigger network issues. Also keep in mind devices in your home especially microwave ovens and older 2.4ghz wireless phones can really muck things up.

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Everything should show up on your computer under Explorer/Network. If they don’t then there’s your problem. If you can see all the devices, then rt click on them and click Properties, and in there you should find the IP address.
I would strip down the Network including Ethernet switches, reset the router (won’t really do much, but ya never know), and add everything back in one at a time; and with each addition, check for it on the computer. If it’s not there, then reset the Network under Network settings and that should find it. then rt clk, properties, find the IP address and jot it down on your list of devices. Btw, each time you reset the the Network, it takes around 5 minhtes or so.
You could also try just resetting the Network to begin with, and it might find and ID all your devices.
Anyway tho, I’d use your computer to fix the Network.
This is all Win10 stuff. If you’re a Mac user it probably doesn’t apply.
Best of luck.

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Sound to me like typical mesh issues. Your Likley running unknown to you several different networks and each device is connecting to one or the other. Roon and Naims app won’t see past the current local network it’s on so that’s why you see some of them. Likely either your 5ghz and 2.4ghz are seperate networks or the wifi and wired are.

This can be down to incorrect DHCP settings. If your adding orbi to an existing router then you need to ensure its getting all it’s IP addresses from the router and is set to use DHCP. If not then it will give it outs own IP addresses and your router will also be doing the same. If you connect to WiFi or a wired connection to your router it will hand out a different range to your orbi and so you have two networks.

You can check to see if this is the case by checking the network ip address on each device when connected to them. If the first three groups of numbers don’t match then your not using DHCP. E.g. NDX2 might be, QB might be if they all start with 192.168.1 then they are all on the same network.

Devices on 2.4GHz should be able to communicate with devices on 5GHz without any problems. Unless the router is faulty, of course.

I have had exactly the same router and the same (only wireless) network setup since 3 years: I very rarely had the problem of a device not showing up in the control point. When it happened, it always turned out to be a problem of the device, not of the network. However, I have no Naim endpoints in my household. In this forum, I have come across many reports of visibility issues similar to the one posted by @JSQT in conjunction with Naim endpoints, especially in wireless LANs.

Just access the web interface of your router (type the name of your router or its IP address in a browser) and have a look at your wired and wireless networks. You should immediately see a list telling you which devices is connected to which network or repeater and which devices are not connected to any (wireless or wired) network.

It’s real for some people, I’ve heard of this many times.
See number 1 Why Your Brand-New Smart Home Devices Won’t Work, and How to Fix Them | Wirecutter
Sometimes the answer is reboot the router, or reset it back to factory settings and set it up again.

I used to have a BT smart hub router for WiFi and an old Apple Airport as a separate wireless access point. It was a pain in the a***e, even if the Apple was set to broadcast the same network ssid and password as the BT hub. Lots of connection issues with the NAIM app if moving around the house.

I ditched the Apple a year ago and now have a BT mesh system, using three discs to broadcast WiFi. Absolutely rock solid, I’m so glad I ditched the Apple.

The NAIM app is probably the most reliable app of all the apps on my iPhone. Almost bullet proof in my experience, given a decent network, controlling 3 MuSos, an NDX2 and a UnitiCore.

Thanks everyone for all the pointers. I will have to get into the Orbi platform to review the network IP addresses etc on all of these items. Unfortunately Orbi is owned by Netgear and it is nearly impossible to get into my Netgear apps anymore as their passwords no longer work and Netgear says it’s not their problem it’s the device issue (Orbi). This is a known issue as people on Netgear forums have similar issues and I have spent several hours with Netgear support trying to get into my account only to have them tell me nothing is their fault and they cannot help with anything.

I should mention I believe this Netgear account access issue is NOT associated with my Naim app issues, it is an access issue with the Netgear/Orbi app.

I will look into this more over the weekend. Of course at this point in time lo and behold all of my Naim products are currently showing up both in the Naim app and Roon, so what I suspect is happening is that it’s not the gear that is the issue but whatever I am using to access the network (ie the iPhone, iPad, MacBook, etc).

One thing that would help - I am unclear as to how I could assign a FIXED/static IP address to specific gear. Is that something I would have to access through the Netgear/Orbi app or can it be done on the Naim app? I am using a Mac so the Explorer option @david1111 mentioned is not going to work for me.

Thanks again.

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That’s normally done in the control panel of your router. Default would be dhcp on, ie give the next available IP address out. There will then be an option to fix the ip per item which just means to the router “when you next see this device, use this ip”.
Having said that, my ndx2 is always “29” but it’s not fixed. The router has been off with power cuts but hasn’t changed its mind about that.
The Naim app and roon (for wired at least, I assume also those on WiFi) will show you the IP address of each unit so you could compare. In the Naim app, look at the about screen.

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I have an Orbi and works fine with my muso and nd555. I use the Orbi to set up fixed ip addresses. If you login into Orbi using a browser, go to advanced/setup/wan you set them up there.

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Thanks guys, as mentioned unfortunately I have no control over my Orbi router and Netgear has made no effort to help. One day my Orbi password just stopped working, and when you follow their instructions to reset your password you get a 404 Bad Gateway message on your browser. Netgear has been absolutely no help trying to resolve this so I’m actually looking into Netgear mesh router alternatives because it’s untenable for a long-term solution.