Why don’t you try Chris’ suggestion above?
Agree with @Neilb1906 and @ChrisSU that starting with a UPnP server is a good suggestion, independent of your Airplay issues.
Easiest route for you, as you already use Windows Media Player on your Windows 11 laptop, might be simply to Enable Media Streaming (can use search in start menu to jump there immediately)… in my case, my Nova was automatically discovered. If you prefer, there are other servers (like Asset), but this should work fine to try and learn and so on.
Good to discover that the Airplay glitching can be defeated, even if it’s via a complicated route … gives hope that a more direct solution, eg from iPhone Music app directly, will be possible for you as well.
Thanks for your ongoing patience and assistance. I would really struggle without all your suggestions.
I am putting off going down the UPnP route until Airplay is sorted - one thing at a time. I don’t want to introduce something else new and possibly complicate confuse things any more than they are (for me). That’s why I explored WMP because it’s already there and I could get DLNA to stream from there to the Naim (for now).
I want to go down the music server route at some point, hopefully soon, possibly with a Naim Uniti Core. Baby steps, which is why I’m delaying subscription to a streaming service until Airplay is fixed - if that’s possible.
Thanks again one and all, much appreciated.
Hi all
I finally contacted Naim direct to see if they have any knowledge or experience to bear on this strange streaming anomaly. I’ll post again if/when there is something to report in the hope that it results in a positive outcome and might help anyone else who happens to come across the same phenomenon.
Cheers for now.
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Comments:
- Playing from media player on Windows will use UPnP; media player being the source and controller, remote controlling the streamer as an endpoint.
- If AirPlay starts but „stutters“ regularly, this sound like the synchronization not working. (E.g. the base for having multiple AirPlay endpoints playing in synch.) Sadly, the most primitive LANs (including WiFi) won’t have a problem with this, only those who try to be „smart“. (Optimizing traffic flows, security features, …)
- What happens, when you stream to both AirPlay endpoints at the same time? (Just as experiment.)
- If you have a large enough stick or external disk, you can copy your iTunes folder to it, plug it into the streamer, and play it directly there. It‘s not 1:1 the same UI/options like playing from iTunes, and indexing will take long with such a big library. But it’s an option. (If you regularly update your library, is can get cumbersome, since you need to switch where the drive is plugged in. But if you have a spare drive, it’s easy to test.)
Thanks
Interesting advice, I hadn’t thought of that! Much appreciated.
Firstly, I didn’t know that WMP used UPnP, so that is good to confirm and is promising if I can get this sorted and acquire a Naim Uniti Core. WMP, at least works, even though WMP will only play one track at a time after hours of indexing.
I tried streaming iTunes via Airplay to the Naim ND5 XS2 and SKY/LG and the former still glitches while the others don’t and play nicely. This indicates (perhaps naively) that the wi-fi is fine (and I don’t have any other issues with it), so it still seems to be something about Airplay that is not quite working right with the Naim or with Airplay implementation within the Naim. I hope Naim support will have an answer and hopefully, a solution.
I haven’t tried a USB stick yet. I don’t have one large enough to hold my iTunes library (which is regularly updated). That remains an unknown just at this moment.
Let’s keep working on it and, hopefully, resolve it so that I can get on and enjoy some music!
Quick update…
Jordan from Naim was very helpful. He has advised that a fully independent test by a Naim dealer would confirm whether Airplay glitching is a connectivity issue or a fault with the ND5 XS2. If it’s the former, I don’t know what the answer is. If it’s the latter, it will have to be a repair at Naim (yikes!). I’ve arranged for the test later this week and I’ll post the result as soon as I have a definitive answer.
NB. I’ve just invested in a Naim Uniti Core as a server for the ND5 XS2, so I’m still hoping for the best as far as the Airplay issue is concerned.
Hi Tonykins
I’m virtually certain this will turn out to be a wi-fi issue.
Airplay works either via wi-fi>wi-fi, wi-fi>ethernet or even ethernet>ethernet.
Years ago I had an Apple Airport Express which had audio out, it worked with Airplay’s predecessor Airtunes.
My wi-fi was far from as good as it is now (and it still could be better), but dropouts happened every few seconds, either due to distance or interference (microwave especially bad when in use), but the symptoms were audio glitches.
There are many causes of wi-fi interference including other local/neighbouring networks, baby monitors, microwaves, various appliances - try a search.
Suggestions:
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Even if your router has AC wireless try to establish if the iPhone/laptop are connecting with the network using n speeds or higher rather than older b/g speeds. Your router might be configured for a slower speed somehow by default or falling back to a lower speed for compatibility with the slowest device on the network, depending on the type and router configuration.
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Run a speedtest on the wi-fi devices and see what results you’re getting for internet speeds, they might be surprisingly low, in which case the internet connection and/or the wi-fi connectioon speed may be lower than expected. If you are getting blistering transfer speeds on an internet speed test your local wi-fi can’t be that slow as it would otherwise limit this.
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Is there something on your network either ethernet or wi-fi that may be hogging internet access and choking performance for other devices - iPhones or other devices automatically backing up to the cloud can kill performance especially with ADSL when slower upload bandwidth is saturated as this slows requests for other data coming inwards when requested by other LAN devices. Say for example you’d recently enable iCloud backups and you had 50GB of photos to upload with 20 Mbps upload speed - it would take ages. Other examples might be large software updates, torrents of many large files of whatever nature.
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Is there something right next to your router which could be causing interference? Is the router encased in anything which could slow connectivity?
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Try to see if there’s any difference between files downloaded to Apple Music or iTunes vs streamed from Apple Music as if the files are already downloaded on the device that cuts out communication to Apple servers to fetch a stream which is relayed to the streamer not accessed directly.
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If you haven’t done so restart the router, fully power off the streamer then unplug/restart it. Consider turning off other boxes reliant on the Sky router including the Sky Q box - odd that Airplay works to those and the Marantz though.
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Try a different ethernet cable, just a bog standard one - the Naim streamers do not have gigabit ethernet but 100 Mbps is more than adequate for audio, especially if required buffering is taken into consideration. The ethernet cable could be faulty even if it’s working after a fashion.
Testing at a dealership would be sensible, but if not that simple could you try the streamer at a friend’s house somehow on their network?
Good luck.
AC
@Tonykins not withstanding the advice from support to use a dealer, in your own home remove and switch off sky q totally from your network - disconnect it, then restart router and then see if your problem still remains. Sky Q has in the past created issues on wifi. Worth considering that if your Sky router doesn’t handle multicast well, then that may be the cause of some of the issues you are experiencing. Another option is to disable your wifi, beg, borrow or buy a Ubiquiti WAP, connect by patch cable to router and once set up, test if any problems remain.
Just because your wifi works in unicast mode, it unfortunately doesn’t ensure that it handles multicast correctly. Previous posts on the forum have highlighted that UPnP and AirPlay use multicast in their discovery methods.
Thanks @Alley_Cat and @sound-hound and everyone else, much appreciated.
My inclination from the outset and my initial research made me think that connectivity was the problem with Airplay glitching, rather than the ND5 XS2. It’s boxed up, ready for its dealer test, so other experiments will have to wait until I know that outcome.
The Wi-Fi/broadband Internet service is running at around the average speed for SKY in Cornwall (repeated tests):
Ping: 32ms
Jitter: 53
Download: 40.7Mbps
Upload: 7.8Mbps
I would have thought those results should be good enough. Airplay is only streaming AAC files from iTunes, so nothing lossless or hi-res.
I ran Naim Network scans from the app and sent them to Jordan at Naim and there wasn’t anything out of the ordinary. Perhaps some interference from other services in the area but connectivity appeared to be good.
I experience the glitching problem every time with Airplay irrespective of any other usage (from none to online gaming). I have tried disconnecting all SKY Q loads on the wi-fi - no difference. The router is about 1 metre from the Naim. I have also tried a standard CAT5 cable instead of the Audioquest Ethernet - again no difference. In addition, the problem is evident whether wired or wi-fi in all permutations.
I have fully reset/restarted the router, the ND5 XS2, laptop, iPhone and the Naim app from cold to ensure I didn’t fall foul of the ‘have you turned it off and on again’ trap. For fans of The IT Crowd, I haven’t “tried to force an unexpected reboot”.
Unfortunately, I don’t have access to friends to test at their homes, hence why the dealership has been brought in.
NB. I have had to replace my laptop in the last few days - the problem persists with a brand new installation.
I think I’ve tried most of the obvious problem-solving techniques, although I am very open-minded to try other experiments. I still have a niggling feeling that it’s connectivity, rather than the Naim, although the evidence so far looks to be the other way around.
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Yes, sounds as though you’ve tried most of the usual solutions.
I believe Airplay 2 is implemented in software so unless there’s an underlying hardware fault affecting it (you’d think other things would be affected too) or firmware somehow corrupted it’s odd.
Annoying nonetheless. I think most of us consider these issues to be connectivity issues which can be spurious most of the time, but not necessarily, and those internet speeds should be fine for audio streaming as you say.
Thanks @Alley_Cat. It is truly mystifying. As I’ve said before, I am either very unlucky or there is something going on somewhere that doesn’t seem to have affected anyone else. If it is software (I agree that Airplay should not be hardware related), maybe Naim can identify the issue and come up with a solution for a future firmware update. Nothing else appears to be a problem - it’s a wonderful piece of kit. It would be highly unusual for Naim to be faulty. I have to be honest and say that it has not given me much confidence just starting out in the darkside dimension that is streaming.
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Quick Update… I am vindicated! It is not me!!! The ND5 XS2 was taken to Richer Sounds in Plymouth for an independent test of the Airplay glitching issue. Straight away, the exact same Airplay glitching occurred in their test. Only the ND5 XS2 and its power lead were in common with my home environment and the test one. Sadly, this suggests a fault with the ND5 XS2 and probably necessitates a return to Naim for investigation and repair (if I can afford it!). At this point, I would like to thank Jordan at Naim and Josh at Richer Sounds for their help. I will update again when I have further news. Thanks again everyone for your input.
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Thanks for the update.
While surprising, I suppose in a way that’s good news if it’s the unit - assuming there’s not frimware corruption of any kind it would be interesting to know what the problem is - faulty buffer memory/memory maybe?
Thanks @Alley_Cat. I was surprised too. I felt that it ‘should’ have been a connectivity issue, even though the evidence seemed to suggest a fault with the ND5. I was beginning to doubt my own common sense and sanity, so it was good to have my experiences validated. I’m not going mad and my problem solving was sound after all. If it goes to Naim and they let me know what the cause is, I will certainly let everyone know, as it may help someone else. I think I’m just unlucky, as it seems such an unusual phenomenon. At least it has ruled out a lot of other possible variables and Naim can now focus on finding a specific solution. Fingers crossed. I’ll keep y’all posted.
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Did you get it at that RS branch?
Could they or the original vendor (assuming not a personal sale) loan you one to see that it definitely works as expected at home?
Presumably you at least tried a factory reset. I cannot imagine what hardware would have failed inside so its probably what naim will do!
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Thanks @Alley_Cat - I hadn’t thought of that. That would be helpful if it can be done. Richer Sounds don’t sell the ND5 XS2 and my nearest high-end Naim dealers are both over 65 miles away. Let’s see what Naim say.
Thanks also @garyi - A factory reset was the first thing I did and it has been done several times in an attempt to resolve the issue, sadly to no effect. All other elements, (sources and endpoints) were also reset more than once. Airplay is most probably implemented in software so, if Naim can fix it, it may be part of a future firmware update. The thing is that the fault seems so leftfield, it may not be quick. I will be very interested what Naim come up with.
Its an interesting one, FWIW I run a full unifi system throughout the house and Airplay has consistently been at best flaky, I rarely use it any how as I have roon, but on the occasions I do, its pot luck if devices show up outside of apples ecosystem. I certainly wouldn’t want to be hanging any potential future with streaming off it.
Thanks again @garyi. I have an existing sizeable iTunes library with >75k tracks (mostly AAC), so the ability to access this legacy resource alongside >5k CDs, lossless/hi-def streaming services and Internet radio is important to me. It’s an ‘and-and’ rather than ‘either-or’. I don’t want to run parallel incompatible systems - the hope is to integrate where poss. Airplay certainly won’t be the primary method moving forward but I can’t have it not working.