Looking for an upgrade from SuperUniti

Hi-Fi Corner
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As much as I’ve enjoyed my SuperUniti, I’ve had mixed feelings about the naim app (great when it works, but doesn’t always connect) and more recently about the fact that the legacy streams have been left behind to things like Qobuz and Tidal Connect (in the future) So I’ve picked up an Innuos Zen server/streamer and have been happy using that as my source. Which means the SuperUniti’s streamer is no longer required. That’s when I started thinking of replacing it with a decent DAC and integrated amp.

So my question is, would going with a Nait XS3 or a second hand SuperNait 2 be the more logical set up?

I don’t have a Turntable, but I’ve always wanted to get into vinyl at some point, but that’s in a few years time. So my source at the moment would be Innuos Zen via DAC and an Apple TV via AirPort express (Optical) which would have to go via the DAC as well.

On the DAC side, I’ve narrowed it down to the Chord Qutest, or possibly the RME ADI-2, but would a used nDAC be worth considering?

I know a home demo is the best way to decided, but not sure I’d be able to get all these in at the same time to test. Especially if they’re second hand. So I thought I’d see what others think.

than again, I could just not worry about the streamer side of the SuperUniti and just enjoy the music. It sounds very good now, as it is.

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Have you considered a Nova instead of separates?

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I have, and it would be the logical choice to go with the Nova.

However, not sure if for the price I would be getting the same SQ as I would with a SX3 and a Chord Qutest for instance. and also I would be doubling up on the streamer side of things again. Plus (and I know this might be a small number of people in reality) the Naim app and the new Uniti range have had some issues lately. Not sure if it’s all been fixed now. But I din’t want to be sending it in for repairs. Or worse not being able to return it even thought I feel it’s not right.

4

Yes i understand where you’re coming from, there is always a trade off.

For what it’s worth, i think the Nova sounds really good compared to the SuperUniti (i’ve owned both). So if you would decide to go for a single box then it could be an option to consider, removing the Innuos and the Chord from the chain and only add a separate NAS (Synology/QNAP) for storage.

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I back @litemotiv on Nova.
It seems , honestly, that you’re “problem “ is more the app then the system.( read SQ).

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Hi DomTom,

I remember how conflicted things were when you landed on the SuperUniti due to delivery delays, hardware problems, and feature changes in the released new Uniti platform from both the old one and the advance marketing photos. It’s great that your choice of the SU has served you well for these years, and your desire to move again is happening only now that even newer things are coming out.

As you may recall, I did move from SU to Nova back then… and for me, like a couple of others in this thread, it has been a solid and happy move. The streaming features work well, and I easily enjoy both the Naim App and the native Roon Endpoint control routes. Lots to be said for this “natural progression” path… but not if you are still less than pleased with the Naim app.

I also recently bought an RME ADI DAC FS as a separate headphone station. I feed it from a RPi4/RoPieee streamer and it is amazing.

Given that you have already purchased the Innuos Zen streamer, my suggestion if you go this route would be to just add a power amp and use the RME as a pre as well as a DAC. No need for doubling up on everything, as you say. I think you could try this out into the SU as power amp (but not sure anymore if there is an input that bypasses the pre?) before you start choosing…

But this path really takes you away from Naim, I think. Not that there’s anything wrong with that, of course!!

It also leaves you without an analog input for future vinyl expansion. The Nova is great in this regard (I just added a TT to my main setup; the digital preamp in the Nova uses/requires an ADC on the analog inputs)… but the studio provenance of the RME Pro DAC, which has an amazing ADC side as well, unlike the DAC-FS, might be something to consider if you are going totally outside the box.

If you’re sold on the Zen, or if it’s beyond the return / refund date, my advice is to optimize your next move based on your new streamer.

If you already know you want the RME, just add power (it’s a good pre) or even powered monitors.

If you want to add an external DAC only, maybe look elsewhere than the RME and also look to a Naim integrated like the SuperNait3 (which addresses your future plans for phono at the same time). With this latter setup, you could choose a cheaper DAC-only unit to get started (there are lots to choose from) and free funds for the new SN3 integrated with the SU trade-in sooner rather than later. My expectation (based on reading, not a demo) is that the SN3 would be a decent amplifier upgrade over the Nova in the same way that the Nova improves on the SU. There’s more to these new models than just feature tweaks …

Food for thought, and best wishes as you navigate your path forward. Exciting times, enjoy the journey as well as the destination.

Regards alan

ps - The extent of Naim app / firmware issues often seems to me like it might be worse on the forum due to the nature of the interactions here, but there is always a risk that you could get bitten yourself, which is frustrating and painful indeed… the beta program is extremely useful as a place to go for early solutions and to highlight any issues that you are facing in your use case… a gentle recommendation to revisit that concern one last time before you really step away.

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Hi Alan, appreciate all the recommendations. Lots of food for thought. I will take my time and make sure I move in the right direction. I’m actually in the middle of trialing Roon for the second time (did it last year) and I’m really enjoying it this time around. So a Nova might be the way forward, as its Roon ready. And I can then choose to ignore the Naim app if it doesn’t behave.
for what’s it’s worth the Naim app has been solid on my iPhone and iPad for over 2 years. it’s in the last month or so that it started to loose connection and “can’t find rooms”

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Ah! Did not realize you were enjoying the second attempt at Roon… the Nova is definitely worth checking out, since it’s all the convenience and performance of the SU, plus.

Are you firm on the Zen? That’s a pretty big investment to set aside, no??

Regards alan

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Both the nDac and SN2 are bargains these days due to their discontinuation. I have an SN2, and it’s quite the impressive performer. Especially with an outboard PS.
I’ve also heard a lot of superlative reviews (from members) on the nDac, so it would be an excellent combo and work well with your Innuous.
The Naim App signal drop would almost have to be a connection issue, such as if you’re connected to your router via WiFi. I had issues as well until I hard connected, which also improved the SQ. If you are already wired, maybe try replacing the Ethernet cable.
Just some thoughts.
Best of luck.

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Thanks David, Yes I know know the SN2 is a great performer. But I’ve read that the XS3 might be getting close in SQ to it as well
I’ve always been hard-wired from day one. I think the issues might be with the iOS software more than anything. But I will be keeping an eye to see how often I get a problem, and will try a few options on my network.

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I don’t see much point in buying a Naim streamer if you have the Innuos. You already have Roon, Qobuz etc. covered. I would just buy a Supernait and a DAC of your choice.
Maybe worth holding out for a Supernait 3 if you want to add a turntable as it has a built in phono stage.

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Direct comparison of the Nova against the SuperUniti here…

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Thanks ChrisSU, I keep coming back to the same conclusion. As much as I like the all in one Uniti design, I’m thinking Keep the Innuos, getting a chord Qutest and a Nait XS 3 (there’s a few on promotion at the moment) :thinking:

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…reading through the thread it appears you are looking at the all-in-one Nova or Separates with an integrated amp SN or XS with a streamer. Have you asked a dealer if you could listen to both set-ups in a demo room and possible home demo?

A lot of satisfied users of both configurations on the forum. I decided a few years back on going with an XS 2 and ND5 XS which migrated to the current configuration of XPS DR, NDX 2, HiCap DR and SuperNait 2 which I am very happy with. Also happy that a local dealer allowed time in his demo room and at home while I took the time to decide.

Good luck with your decision and have fun along the way…

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15

The nait 2 is interesting because
Emotional
Historic
bautyful
But this amp will never reach the sound and Performance of a new naim amp

The good thing - that’s not important

If you want sth better than a sn3 - there is sth out there…
Better naim equipment
McIntosh
Or other sh…

The Nait 2 will always be a very nice special amp
It is a beauty

My rec.

i would go with a atom

Or
sn3 & or nait 1 or 2
And a separate dac
Denafrips ares II
Or budget version a topping d50

Finito
Just my taste

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That isn’t to say that getting an ND5XS2 is a bad idea, it just seems a bit unnecessary to have both that and the Innuos. An ND5 plus NaitXS or Supernait would be a nice system. You would still need another box hidden away somewhere to run the Roon Core though.

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Over in System Pics, @Roog just posted a beautiful photo of his system:

As you can see, it’s the RME that is under test as DAC-pre, with the SU acting as the streamer… not your exact situation @DomTomLondon but potentially of interest given not too many others would have this exact combination of equipment in their living rooms!

I’m also interested to hear what the amplifier is, and @Roog’s impression?

Regards alan

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Hi Alan, thanks for pointing me to this. I’ll have a closer look.

At the moment I’m trying to arrange to hear a Nait XS 3 in my setup at home. So I can get a better idea of how much better it will sound compared to the pre/power in the SU.
If I like it, I’d keep it and then looking at which DAC will best match.

I know the RME could be used as a Pre, but I think I’s rather stick to a Naim Preamp, so I don’t loose the Naim sound.

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HI @DomTomLondon, I can understand your wish to retain the ‘Naim sound’ although I have to confess I couldn’t tell you what that is.
As I mentioned in the System pics thread I found that the RME gave greater resolution when compared to the SU, and sounded quite neutral. For my taste, I find the SU into the NAP 300DR adds a little emphasis, like its trying to impress, like the ‘loudness button’ on old 70’s amps.

@alan33 I have tried a few pre amps and a couple of DAC pres with my NAP 300DR and the RME for me has made the best job of it so far.

I say so far, because I am forever trying new kit, mostly for the fun of it and I have a new project waiting to be built I just need to find the energy to get going.

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I don’t think a XS, amp wise was better than SU.
IME go for at least a SN or separates if you wish amp improvement.

Oh, and completely disagree with above poster, the Nait 2 is certainly an option and I’d choose it for any Mc.intosh in the world every day of the year (apart from the value of course, I just dislike the blue lights and screwed timing to say it mildly)