Moving Coil v Moving Magnet

[feeling_zen]

Yes. I do wonder how many MC lovers have ever, in their own system, gone back and given modern MM a serious second chance at a higher end than they left it behind originally at.

You see very few comments about that (a couple on this thread though) and it seems like those that did were pleasantly surprised.

[HAS]

I second that, well at least in my own experience. I have multiple turntables and sometimes I change one to another just for the fun of it. One of them is an Audio Technica AT LPA2, the full acrylic turntable come with AT OC9XEN MC cartridge. Even after replacing the cartridge with OT OC9XSH, a Shibata MC, I still prefer listening to my Audio Note IQ3 MM cartridge on my AN TT2 turntable. (Quite far) Better in clarity, staging, sound separation, dynamic and obviously on the bass.

Of course one could argue that, arguably, my Audio Note turntable (with its tonearm & AN M2 Phono) is on different class than the Audio Technica turntable, although I paired it with NVC TT phono stage to reduce the gap in performance. Additionally, OC9X MC cartridge is more at “beginner level” of MC among many other series of AT MC cartridges.

[feeling_zen]

@HAS

Of course one could argue that, arguably, my Audio Note turntable (with its tonearm & AN M2 Phono) is on different class than the Audio Technica turntable,

Yes, this is a fair comment though. I had a low end Oyster on a fairly mid range deck and it was pretty boring. A better MM on the same deck really sung. But that same Oyster on a much higher end deck blew the other deck and better cart out of the water. I could scarcely believe it was the same cart.

[PeterJersey]

Thanks to everyone for all the comments and advice on this subject.

The time has come for me to come clean and admit to having owned between 20 and 30 record decks over the last 50 years and until very recently I was always on MM but from experience when I bought a Michell Orb a few years back I had an MM Goldring 2500 on that and was rather good. However recently I converted to MC Rega Aphelion which I put on an upper mid range Rega deck. Detail was excellent, and treble excellent and lively, but bass severely lacking. A swap of the MC to the Michell was a revelation bass came alive and it sounded just like a live performance. So my advice is only buy a moving coil if you have a really high end deck otherwise MM is just fine.

As for old MM cartridges from the decades back I still have a soft spot for the Shure V15 mk4 with its damping brush. Cheap to buy and a decent performer.

[Collywobbles]

Yes, I have found that a better deck trumps a better cart every time.

[Skeptikal]

@feeling_zen

Yes. I do wonder how many MC lovers have ever, in their own system, gone back and given modern MM a serious second chance at a higher end than they left it behind originally at.

You see very few comments about that (a couple on this thread though) and it seems like those that did were pleasantly surprised.

I did

[alto]

Some mid-range and high-end MM cartridges provide excellent satisfaction compared to MC cartridges, which are more revealing but insufficiently compatible with characteristics, settings, and operating conditions. Having had the pleasure of attending demonstrations of Audiotechnica MM and MC cartridges on the same turntable, with the same tonearm and phono preamp,
the MC ART 9 provided greater integration with the music.
The MM 760 slc was excellent in its field, but could not compete with the ART.

[Skeptikal]

@alto
Hi
Did you see my reply to you.?

Moving Coil v Moving Magnet

@alto Sorry for the delay in reply. Changing from the original stylus is quite an improvement and being that this is probably the go to new replacement for the cartridge this takes it forward with technological improvements. I don’t want to bore you with superlatives but a general all round upgrade is obvious. Bass is deeper top end sweeter and the midrange is still very detailed as it was but it all seems bigger and faster with no splashy or bright extension added to the treble. It’s a ve…

I do get it that some are better but at the costs and inconvenience of deck rebuilds and arm removals for changes I decided what I did was best for long term
There are always going to be differences and that’s what we eventually have to compromise on .
I changed to my AT MM from a Linn Urika phono stage and Linn Kandid Cartridge.
I’m not saying it doesn’t sound better but nothing like the price and long term inconvenience and expense.
I’ve been in this hobby over 45 years and in and out of the trade so it was great to have tried many things but have to realise there is always a compromise and at my age now I fancy a quiet time not constantly running in the hamster wheel.
I now have quick change stylus and with TrigB a three point mount for my Linn Ekos SE/1 arm.
Been there done that.

[Murmur]

Not needing my dealer to replace an MC every year or so is comforting. Nothing against seeing my dealer of course but it’s a hassle and just another thing in life that needs sorting.

I also appreciate the sonic benefits of a good MM and don’t miss the sonic benefits of a good MC as much as I thought I would.

[Skeptikal]

@Murmur

I also appreciate the sonic benefits of a good MM and don’t miss the sonic benefits of a good MC as much as I thought I would.

Well said and nice to be honest too.

[Igel]

I have tried to go back to MM and MI ,but miss the musicality of MC.

[Fatcat]

I noticed an interesting video on youtube a few weeks ago comparing Denon DP-3000NE vs Technics SL-1300G.

Part of an album is digitised using a Denon DP-3000NE - Technics SL-1300G - Technics SL-1200GAE, with a very nice sounding £800 MM cartridge.

Ortofon Concorde Music LVB 250.

Hoff Ensemble, Polarity vinyl release from 2L

Using

Ortofon Concorde Music LVB 250 Cartridge

Supra Phono cable with ground cable

PARASOUND zPhono XRM Phono Stage (rumble filter off).

People might be surprised how good the MM cartridge and DD turntables sound

[Fatcat]

@PeterJersey

As for old MM cartridges from the decades back I still have a soft spot for the Shure V15 mk4 with its damping brush. Cheap to buy and a decent performer.

I find on some records, 80s rock for example an old MM sounds better than the a Denon DL103R.
I use a Shure encore ME75ED or Grado f3+, sound pretty good considering age.

Having removable headshellds makes swapping over very easy.

[daddycool]

This, it is never a cartridge in isolation that makes the overall sound.

For comparison, I have just upgraded my headphones two levels. What I don’t like about it can very well be that I have now exceeded the capabilities of the XS3 built-in headphone amp. Which was fine two levels down and would have probably managed one level up. So before judging the cans in isolation I have to first try a different headphone amp to have a reference point.

They are called systems for a reason, the components are interconnected. Striking the balance for me is the greatest challenge in hifi.

[alto]

Thank you for your review of the AT 760 slc cartridge with the new Audio Technica VMN 60x SL stylus. It’s interesting to learn that it’s a good improvement. The VNM 60xSL stylus can also be fitted to AT 750, 740, and 540 cartridges

[Alley_Cat]

Great thread.

[Skeptikal]

@alto

AT 760 slc cartridge with the new Audio Technica VMN 60x SL stylus.

With this combo it’s now an upgraded TrigB Audio Technica VM760xSL.
Superb all the updates and stylus too.

[sktn77a]

@Fatcat

I find on some records, 80s rock for example an old MM sounds better than the a Denon DL103R.

I’ve never heard a cartridge with the bass of a Denon DL103(D in my case).

[Fatcat]

Additional info regarding my post yesterday.

Link to the Ortofon Concorde Music LVB 250 Cartridge downloads can be found at youtube video titled.

Denon DP-3000NE vs Technics SL-1300G - Weak Point + Verdict (Part 2)

[SteveM33]

You mean £15000?