Naim App Update 👎🏻

I’ve updated the Naim App and even so there are a lot of people requesting a shuffle feature to shuffle all songs of a collection we have been once again totally ignored!!! I guess Naim has grown to big to listen to its customers. Can other streamers do this as I am considering selling the Core?

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I don’t shuffle play much but I can see some people might enjoy this when applied to a whole collection rather than an album.

Don’t suppose there’s a way of creating a playlist of some kind for all tracks and shuffling that? I suspect no or only with difficulty is the answer here - again not one to use playlists, just wondering.

The problem is that some people like to shuffle long playlists, or even their whole library. There is a limit of 500 tracks in a play queue that puts the kibosh on this. It’s a limitation of the Naim app, not the streamer, and on the old streamers, you could bypass the problem by using the remote instead of the app.

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This is not correct!! My Olive 4 HD managed to shuffle 23000 songs - and that was in 2012!!!

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What isn’t?

The 500 song restriction…

But as ChrisSU said, it’s a restriction of the Naim app to hold 500 travks in a playlist.

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As FZ says, it’s a Naim app limit. Nothing to do with the streamers themselves.

That’s really bad then!!! Do the Innuos streamers not have this restriction? Yes, I agree with other guys on other topics here that the Naim Core is totally outdated. Basically I’ve spent a lot of money on very old technology!!! They don’t even reply giving you a reason why they are not willing to integrate this feature!!!

Yes and they no longer exist and their customer service was non existent. Have you contacted Naim with your request?

Yes, I have and no direct reply!! There will be an update which did not sort anything regarding to this!!! Absolutely bad - yes, like Olive Inc.

My experience of shuffle beyond a playlist (which Naim does support) is that in reality, it’s useless.

Whether a streamer or old school CD autochanger, albums have wildly different recording levels. So with shuffle there is constant need to adjust volume between tracks of different albums.

I kind of outgrew even regular shuffle on CD players when I was about 16. It just wrecks continuity of music and makes narrative albums (so most prog rock) unintelligible.

When I want a jukebox, I just use the vTuner to find a decent radio station and let them drive for a while.

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That’s fair enough for you but when you’re used to it then it is an important feature. All I want from Naim to tell me THE REAL reason why they not integrate it or if they will in future upgrades. At least then I can decide if I should get rid of this expensive piece of kit and buy something which does what MOST PEOPLE want.

I expect you hit the nail on the head. For sure they did their research and found that actually few people want it.

Implementing it would invariably also lead to complaints about needing volume normalisation, which implementing requires a universal volume boost followed by dynamic compression. Which is bad for SQ so another reason they are unlikely to do it. But I could be wrong.

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Just out of interest, from where do you get the information that ‘most’ Naim App users want a shuffle facility?

As someone who prefers to listen to albums from start to finish, as they were recorded, I personally would have no use for such a facility. My worry would be that, were Naim to mess with the App, a knock on issue would then pop up elsewhere.

If shuffling is that important to you, why did you buy the Core in the first place? Sounds as though you didn’t do your homework very well?

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Why don’t they openly say so then? There are other serious issues with the app. I just think the software department is not up to scratch :-1:t2:

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Hi, all.

As I think you know, I’m evaluating the update from my Cyrus Xa to the NDX2…

Does the NDX2 have the shuffle in the playlist option…? And, beyond a playlist, even for the whole library…?

I would very much appreciate the clarification; for me it’s important because I work most of the time from home, in the same room where the main system is, and at medium-low volume there’s no problem with different recording levels, and feeded from the NAS SQ is long better than that of the stations radio in compressed formats.

Thank you in advance and greetings.

Well they are famously close lipped.

You won’t be the first person that wants to use a non Naim frontend here. In fact, wanting features of flexibility not offered by Naim is why going down a non Naim route is popular for the source.

They do everything I want so it’s not an issue for me (though I don’t use a core). But others feel different. But indeed out of all the feature griping on the forum (and there’s a lot), Shuffle Play has only come up a couple times.

To chime in: I’ve used shuffle (although on a “per album” schedule, not “per track”) on iTunes for more than a decade - without level adjustment algorithms. And it was perfect for “background music from own library” and still adhering to the “I like to listen album start to end”.
It’s also a good way to “surprise” oneself with music ones likes, but hasn’t heard in a while.

I don’t miss the feature on my Atom (yet), since I use it for “conscious listening” - but if I had a Muso (Qb) for “background listening”, this would be really a feature missed. (And I’d consider streaming from iTunes for that purpose.)

As I understand, the limitation is, that the App pre-calculates the random sequence and then feeds that as a playlist to the device?
If the random-select happens dynamically “while playing”, there’s no need for a long queuing list. (That’s e.g. what iTunes and I assume most other platforms do. They started off with “select next track/album, while current one is playing/just finishing” and these days the select some 20-30 items in advance, so you can remove tracks from the list before they are getting played, if you are inclined to do so.)
The trick is the “dynamic random selection” while playing. This can go “forever” (without special memory needs), if there was so much time for listening.
Seems like the Naim devices need the App to perform the random selection? Then they would have to go back to the App to get more “random input”? That’d be indeed a limitation in the “platform design”, since the App might be switched off / sent to the background / eating up power on the phone, if “always active”.

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Exactly what I was trying to say in several posts!! It’s something the users want - INCLUDING MYSELF!! Take bloody note :facepunch:t2::facepunch:t2::facepunch:t2: