Naim NDS - still a good used buy?

Why ?

I have used my NDS with Roon everyday for the last 3-years now.

I upgraded to the NDS from a ND5XS over 4 years ago (good deal on a BNIB version for a 2nd price), and then a 2nd hand 555DR over the NP5XS.

I also have been a Roon user since it was made available as a Beta release in May ‘15 to those under NDA.

I didn’t use Roon for playback, at first, just Library Management, as it ran on my Windows Laptop and I didn’t want a computer to be on, to be able to play music.
I had started streaming with Squeezebox 3 through a Pink Triangle DAC, good up to 24/48 and LMS running on a ReadyNAS Duo and iPeng on a iPhone 3GS.
A ND5XS replaced that with n-Stream, following a Demo from Naim at Cloney Audio. I tried Twonky on the NAS, but this was replaced with a RPi running Asset. Moving the UPnP server away from the NAS gave a big SQ improvement.

What changed Roon for me was ROCK (May 2017) and getting the Roon Core onto a dedicated server (Intel NUC), then the SonoreUPnP Bridge.
I ran this initially on a SonicOrbiterSE, which couldn’t match the SQ of Asset on the RPi, nor stream up to 24/192, do Gapless etc. A swap out to a UltraRendu did the job, and along with an UltraCap LPS 1.0 in 2018, now runs the SonoreUPnP Bridge perfectly, makes the NDS shine for all locally stored files, internet streamed services, internet Radio (including Lossless 16/44.1 FLAC ones).
I also found that a EtherREGEN for the NDS made a bit different, along with Chord Sarum Streaming cable, and a True Signal Ultimate Silver DIN to RCA interconnect.

As I said in earlier posts, I would like to hear a NDS/SonoreUPnP alongside a ND555 playing through Roon, as Naim only seem to demo the ND555 with a UnitiCore UPnP server.

2 Likes

I’ve never understood this obsession with always needing to have the latest tech.

One thing I’ve learnt over the years is that, despite what the marketing people try and make you believe, newer isn’t always better. I have compared my nDac to an NDX2 on more than one occasion and preferred the former despite it being a design from over ten years ago. It’s not that the NDX2 sounds bad but rather to my ears it’s more of a sideways step than an improvement. I have no problem with new technology but I want to know it is actually an improvement on what I bought previously instead of buying new tech just to say that I have the latest.

The NDS is a still good sounding player - especially at the current used prices. You could buy a used NDS together with a used XPS-DR for less than the price of a new bare NDX2 and I know which would sound better. If you want to use the NDS to play music from your locally stored files then it will likely still perform well for the foreseeable future. It’s only when using it with Internet streaming services that there is a question mark over how long Naim can keep it updated.

10 Likes

No it is not. For 2k€ you can get a modern player with modern features.

Everything else can be bought used … speakers, cables, amps … etc.
Buying a 10 year old streamer is like using winamp 2. yes it will work, but it is not up-to-date. Given your sound card is goog enough, you may find it really nice. But again 2000€ can buy you a lot today. If it was 300€ … ok but not for 2k.

Can’t decide if serious … :thinking:

It’s strange that you emphasise the modern, as if that’s all that matters. When the NDS was introduced it sounded very fine. Firmware updates have improved it further, so it sounds even better today than it did when first introduced. It is still a very fine source if one works within its limitations - local streaming from a server, or internet radio. Tidal works well to. If you insist on built in Qobuz it’s a non starter.

It’s very simple - it’s a great buy if you want a very good sounding player and can live with its limitations. It cannot be dismissed out of hand just because it is not ‘modern’. A current £2,000 player may well do more but won’t sound as good. It’s very much horses for courses.

4 Likes

Worst advice yet. I just hope the OP knows better …

1 Like

Spot on but a bit sad that you had to repeat it. I never understand why some people jump into such threads with a coarse generalization after other members already spent days and lots of posts to work out the fine details of multiple viewpoints.

2 Likes

Some people believe they are right while having no idea what they are talking about.

8 Likes

Succinct as always :smiley:

2 Likes

No it is not. The DAC inside is 10 years old the filters are 10 year old. Just look at what you can get right now in the market. It is worlds apart quality wise. The dac used is a PCM 1704 ( 24-Bit/ 96kHz) looks pretty outdated to me.

Who cares if it sounds right to someone. (And show me the person who can distinguish 24/192 from 24/96). In any case, from https://www.naimaudio.com/product/nds

Audio Formats:

WAV (up to 24bit/192kHz)
AIFF (up to 24bit/192kHz)
FLAC (up to 24bit/192kHz)
DSD (single rate DSF64 & DFF64 only)
ALAC (up to 24bit/96kHz)
WMA (up to 16bit/48kHz) must be WMA 9.2
Ogg Vorbis (up to 16bit/48kHz)
M4a (CBR and VBR up to 320kbit/s)
MP3 (CBR and VBR up to 320kbit/s)
Playlists (M3U, PLS)

1 Like

Do you think that the current Naim flagship ND555 streamer will sound bad because it also uses the PCM1704 DAC chips?

1 Like

Yes for 300€ it’s ok, not for 2K. Because most probably no difference will be perceived, it will be fine, but for the right price.

The same DAC is used in the ND555 which is Naims current flagship player.

Outdated or not it sells well and receives rave reviews and is one of the best streamers available at any price.

1 Like

If that’s your argument, it applies to all fancy streamers. Just get a Node 2i

lmao … yes I strongly believe there are better options out there. But afaik they do some off dac stuff with the signal.

Also I understand the need to defend you purchases, but calm down. I am just stating my own opinion. (Which happens to be the only right one here) But still you are free to do whatever you want and buy all the overpriced 10 year old tech you want.

As i have said and so have others, the NDS is a good sounding unit, its just the streaming board that now lets its down, if you can work around this, then at these prices, its never been cheaper to get your hands on one, plus if you have a naim system already and a power supply you can use, then even better.

3 Likes

Well done Ivo, you’ve managed to troll this thread up quite well. You’ll be able to tell your Mom what fun you had on the Naim forum today when she asks you over dinner what you got up to today.

4 Likes

Yes I will. She will be proud :sweat_smile: