Nd5xs2 vs Allo Signature as transport

upmpdcli comes with 4 streaming plugins (upmpdcli-gmusic, upmpdcli-spotify, upmpdcli-qobuz, upmpdcli-tidal) one of which is for Tidal. This is native streaming for Tidal, to the best of my understanding. I use upmpdcli since years and, although I have meanwhile cancelled all my subscriptions, I have streamed Tidal and Qobuz (but not Idagio, unfortunately) using the upmpdcli plugins.

I typically run only upmpdcli (and MPD, upmpdcli is just a MPD front-end) in a minimal Raspbian Lite distribution or in GenTooPlayer. Without additional software and with all unnecessary interfaces (USB bus, wired Ethernet, HDMI, internal sound card, etc.) switched off, the RPi + DigiOne Signature combo only drains about 0.2A from the two power supplies. It is a very quiet, low power transport.

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If it was a choice purely between ND5 XS2 and the Allo Signature, I’d go with the Naim. It is a great piece of kit and is easy to setup and use.

But, like I mentioned earlier, it may be worth demoing other transport options that focus purely on being a transport as you may end up with better features / SQ spending the same money on a transport rather than transport + DAC, especially if you won’t be using the DAC in it.

Very good point you make actually. If purely used as a transport what else would you consider as a transport for under €1900? And most importantly would they better the ND5XS2 as a transport??

Has anyone tried the Auralic Aries G1 for example against an ND5XS2?

I’m about to. I’ll receive a demo unit on Tuesday next week. At the moment I’m using the ND5 XS2 as transport into a Chord Qutest and the pair do sound great together and in my system / ears and preferred genre of music etc, offers a bit more than the straight ND5 XS2.

Of course, it would be great if the Aries G1 has better SQ but even if it’s the same, I would be gaining a screen, button controls and additional optical outputs that would give me more options in the future if I was to upgrade DAC (not just BNC).

Another option is the Innuos Zen Mk3. This is in the same price range, possibly a little cheaper even and has a hard rive and ripping facilities built in. It also gets great reviews and would be a must to demo if you need a server as well. It doesn’t have a screen, button control or as many digital output options. It all comes down to what features offer the most to you as a user. I don’t think there’s a bad choice amongst them (ND5, G1, Zen Mk3).

Edit… brand new g1 can be found for £1,899 which is the same for the Zen Mk3 with a 1tb hard drive. Open box and ex-demo versions will be available for £100-200 less I’d imagine.

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How would you connect the Zen MK3 to the Naim DAC? The nDAC requires SPDIF inputs, the Zen doesn’t have any SPDIF outpute, I believe.

Another aspect to keep in mind when considering transports for DACs is the software system. You do not want to get locked into a system that is poorly supported and is based on outdated software. Also, I am not sure that I would like to use a propritary control point unless I was sure that it works very well.

What I want to say is that sound quality is important but the best sound quality does not help if the software does not work as it should. One of the big advantages of using devices like the Allo transports (or similar) is that the software is rock solid and one is not at the mercy of companies that are not very good at developing software.

If I was looking for a single box transport with SPDIF outputs and in the price range suggested by the OP, I would probably check the Meridian 210 (about 1000 EUR) or a second hand dCS Network Bridge.

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Check the Meridian 210. It is about 1000 EUR and there is a thread in this forum with a lot of useful information and comparisions to other solutions: Meridian 210

Recently, I’ve been comparing the RPi 3 with a DigiOne (not signature) transport using GentooPlayer running in ram and a Shanti ps against an NDX digital out/analog off with XPSDR ps. Both into a Chord Qutest using a Teddy ps fed by a basic Blue Jean’s BNC to BNC cable.

The NDX/XPSDR keeps on winning and I’ve gone back and forth over the past few days. Just more oomph with the NDX combination. However, the price difference is massive and the sound difference is not! Kudos to opensource and Allo.

I hope to try the Auralic Aries G1 or G2 and as well the Aurender N100H/N100C/N100SC line in the near future when my local dealer has them available. Not sure when that will happen.

Right now the NDX into the Qutest is quite good and the Rpi/DigiOne will go into the second system or act as a backup at least.

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Yes, Allo have done a very good work with the DigiOne, the DigiOne Signature and the USBridge Signature. I have had the DigiOne and I am currently using the DigiOne Signature. As many other manufacturers, Naim and dCS get their streaming platforms from StreaUnlimited. I do not know what is inside the Meridian streamers.

I wouldn’t be. If you were using a Naim DAC, you would be better off with the ND5 XS2 or the NDX2 etc. Using a separate transport can be a good option when feeding a non Naim DAC. In my instance, a Chord Qutest. If it had to go into a Naim DAC and you didn’t want to go ND5 or NX2, then the Aries G1 with it’s many outputs would be a good option.

I also use Roon and for me I always look for a Transport / Streamer that has Roon as a native endpoint. In this case, the ND5 XS2, Innuos Zen Mk3 and Auralic Aries G1 do. I’ve never used the Naim app and very unlikely to ever use a Innous or Auralic app either. As it happens, Auralic seem to get excellent software support with frequent FW updates etc across the range. Roon naturally is extremely well supported.

Edit. For future proofing i.e. experimenting with a number of different DACs etc, aiming to get a transport that provides as many different Digital Outs as possible is the best way to go. Pay the money for a good transport once rather than changing again just so it fits a new DAC you want to try.

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That‘s a very good recommendation to explore. The Meridan unit is “approved” by @MrUnderhill — and I think he wouldn’t be offended if one said he had been a tiny bit obsessed with the digital streaming domain. A few here might remember the Hugo of Streaming thread… :crazy_face:

P.S. @MrUnderhill, I hope you will soon have a chance (after the lock-down?) to compare the Meridan to your friend’s DCS Network bridge. Please tell us when this is happening so that we can get the popcorn… :rofl: :rofl:

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Hi NTD,

:grinning:

Looking forward to doing the comparison, just mired in social distancing restrictions.

M

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qobuz and UPMPDCLI doesn’t work anymore.

for tidal - it is hit and miss, it simple doesn’t work reliably anymore

I just had the chance to test a sonos connect box which has all the streaming platforms, and while the Allo is better sonically, the sonos with all the services is the I would go for if I had to do it all over again.

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Too bad that Qobuz and Tidal do not work anymore with upmpdcli, but thanks for the update! I guess internet streaming companies like Qobuz and Tidal have stopped making their APIs available to the open source community … another reason for cancelling my subscriptions!

It’s was pretty crap for Qobuz any way when I tried it, very limited in what it presented to you compared to what you get in Kazoo, Bubble and Mconnect.

I have Auralic G1 with Qutest, sounds great and it’s a stable platform. G1 has native Tidal, Qobuz, Spotify, Internet radio, Roon, etc

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well for me I need and like streaming company services… so ND5XS2 is high on my wish list

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from my analysis, it isn’t just hardware and sound quality, it is access to the various streaming services… native integration and google chrome cast integration also.

these things Naim paid a lot of money to get right in their streamers.

as far as I know, there is no solution for googlechromecast with any RPI type of hardware.

I’d rather much have sonos/bluesound type of integration with all the major services, or even better, Naim type of integration tidal/spotify/qobuz with Chromecast.

It’s wonderful! (biased opinion of course)

Interesting, as you say it may be hit or miss however Tidal has been fine for me with upmpdcli lately. There was an issue with a Tidal token and upmpdcli not long ago. Maybe what you saw, the updated version is working.

This is the problem sometimes, playing catch up to changes. Even Naim have had issues with the streaming services from time to time. Opensource is not for the faint of heart for sure.

From the upmpdcli changelog:
2020-05-17

upmpdcli 1.4.10 replaces the old Tidal API token, which did not work any more.

Upmpdcli changelog:

"2019-10-06

Qobuz access was revoked: If you were using Qobuz and it’s not working any more, don’t pull your hair, the Qobuz plugin stopped working (either through the Media Server or with OHCredentials). Qobuz revoked the app_id, and also deleted the API documentation on Github."

It’s all on Qobuz, they decided to not play nicely for whatever reason. They broke all devices using upmpdcli, apparently there are several.