Nordost Network Switch

There are I am afraid to say many much better sounding switches than the Netgear - at least in my system. And a good OCXO will set you back a bit more than $100 by the way…

Tut, tut!

3 Likes

Delusion, more money than sense, obsession, illness.

3 Likes

Synergistic Research switch @$2.5k…wow! Get on ebay and use that money to buy a good 2nd hand mic, a spectrum analyser and/or some decent acoustics analysis software. At least you will be able to prove those esoteric bits of hardware are making a difference.

1 Like

I can’t explain but I believe them. I noticed a real uplift in sound with 4.8 app version vs 4.6 for my Nds.
I recently compared Mconnect app vs Naim app for local streaming and found differences easily discernable.
So different app, different versions of the app do impact sound quality.

If you hear it clearly, it exists. But we will end up anywhere discussing about it. Try by yourself and see.

1 Like

Are you talking about the NDS firmware? (The version numbers seem so). I am talking about the app on the phone.

The app says to the streamer: play this file. It has nothing to do with the playback at all. And yet people claim differences

1 Like

I see in your profile you list “Sicomin bases (carbon-kevlar-epoxy)”. How fast are they? Bulletproof too? :grinning:

Touché. But microphony influencing analog circuits is a thing (maybe). It isn’t a thing on digital data.

You will also notice that I have an EE. When building the system I admit that I did a range of things under the influence of the forum, or because recommended by my dealer or other people I know. Even if I did not necessarily believe in them making a difference, or if I could not be entirely sure after casual trials. That’s on the basis that they probably do nothing but won’t hurt and my time and peace of mind is worth more than what, e.g., the EE cost.

But I’m not going around claiming night and day differences based on my golden ears and sloppy testing.

1 Like

I wasn’t trying to suggest anything, I just found the apparent irony amusing… :smile:

@Suedkiez, do you find your EE makes any SQ differences?

@NO-QUARTER, fyi: this is a direct quote from a Lumin top engineer:

"Many users (including those not using a Lumin) found it to sound different.

When we were introducing Lumin X1 we did a demo and A/B comparison. Some (more) users preferred the optical network. Some (less) users preferred copper Ethernet."

1 Like

I agree, it certainly is :slight_smile:

1 Like

I think to remember that you denied too the possibility of differences in sound vs different firmware updates.
As for the app, as I said, I tested recently the Mconnect app vs Naim app for local streaming , through my Nds. Both apps say to the streamer “ play file”. But I noticed clear differences for sound using both apps.

I don’t think so. I have since tried a bit with and without and I don’t think there is.

However, I know for a fact that I hear a difference when I expect the possibility of one, even if there is definitely none - I had this more than once happen to me when trying some things and messing it up. E g. once I had the power cable plugged in that I had always used, but I thought it was the other one that I was trying out. I was convinced it sounded differently until I found out :wink:

Plus, when discussing biases we always focus on the bias of expecting a difference, but it also works the other way around. I.e., my bias of not expecting a switch difference has an effect as well.

So, I can’t hear any difference that is without a doubt. If there is one (that I don’t expect), it would be small enough to require proper, statistically significant, blind testing, and life is too short

2 Likes

I can’t rule out that I took it too far, but I seem to remember that I doubted the hyperbole of “terrible, the bass is completely gone” and things like this, which made it seem as if Naim was using a DSP equalizer while having their ears plugged with hot wax.

In the beta room there is a description by Naim that clearly explains what the tuning is about and what the possible influences are. I can be convinced that it may create subtle changes, just not of the size people were claiming.

But in any case, as mentioned in the previous post, biases work both ways, not expecting a difference influences perception just as much as expecting one.

I don’t know how the MConnect app works, but two subsequent versions of the Naim app work the same.

There are optical illusion pictures where people see lines that are not parallel although they are, and where some people see blue color and others gold. And so on, you know some examples, and there are literally thousands or more well documented examples of how easily our senses are deceived. Nobody ever claims in these cases that their eyes are objective.

[Edit: To add, the same goes for audio illusions. Not too long ago, a video made the rounds where one would hear different words depending on which person one looked at, although the actual words were the same. Some people made a career out of hearing Satan in Beatles songs, and they subjectively did, just by expecting it and listening for long enough. And so on, the list is endless]

I am not doubting subjective differences, you hear what you hear, like I do. And I heard a difference between two power cables although the cable was actually the same, as per the previous post. I have many other examples. Like once I had a friend blind test for differences depending on whether an Ethernet-over-mains device was plugged in. And they heard one, except that in some of the repetitions I hadn’t actually changed anything.

The fallability of the human senses really is not up for discussion. And if there is no logical, technical, or measurable explanation either, our subjective impressions, mine just like anyone else’s, simply are not good enough.

Which, once again, leaves us in the same place as always.

2 Likes

I’m doing my best to ignore this thread. Its like listening to a group of old men tutting at the foolishness of youth. Judgemental at best, close minded at worse

2 Likes

So why are you here?

1 Like

That’s a very deep question. I think its probably to propagate the species but that could be a simplification of course

3 Likes

It does but I’ve tried to ignore it and assumed its just closed mindedness