Path to phase out n272

Give them a call, anyway. Shipping rates from the UK are not too bad.

I bought a 252 from them in December and I am one very happy customer.

Thanks, I will certainly do this when I have made up my mind!

Reading other similar topics and contemplating my choices, restricted by my budget steps of around €5k each time and my preferred future amp state, I guess for me it comes down to this.

I take the path starting out with a focus on the streamer/dac part, or on the pre-amp part.

Steps to work towards, within roughly equal budget limits, changes in bold;

Path 1:

  • n272/xpsdr/250dr
  • ndx2/xpsdr/282/napsc/250dr
  • ndx2/xpsdr/282/hicap-dr/250dr
  • ndx2/xpsdr/282/supercap-dr/250dr
  • ndx2/xpsdr/252/supercap-dr/250dr

Path 2:

  • bluesound node 2i/n272/282/hicapdr/250dr
  • bluesound node 2i/n272/282/supercapdr/250dr
  • bluesound node 2i/n272/252/supercapdr/250dr
  • Either n272 -> xpsdr -> ndx2 or a non Naim streamer/dac solution.

The timing of the last step in path 2 is flexible, whenever a better option comes along I can change the 272 at any moment, because of the 282 in step 1.

I will sleep on it and still have some saving to do, but I am leaning towards path 2. I once started the journey for musical amplification. Sure, “source first”, but sources have proven to be moving technical targets which require flexibility, amplification separates on the other hand make for a stable solid basis, in my own humble opinion of course. Box count is not an issue for me.

First, you should bear in mind that the 282 requires both a NAPSC and either a Hicap or a Supercap, when partnered with a 250. That aside, your 'path 1 makes more sense to me than keeping the dated 272 - without an XPS to power it, you would probably be better off with an ND5XS2, to which you could add a separate DAC later to bring its performance more in line with the amp you are looking at.

Thank you Chris, I didn’t know this! Doesn’t really change the two paths for me to choose from luckily. I agree somewhat on the nd5. Having owned the previous version, I didn’t like it not having a screen. Also, in path 2, I am not looking at the streamer per se, will think about it.

Indeed - the 272 is a perfectly decent pre-amp :smiley:

Ah, and then the doubt arises: is decent good enough for investing an xpsdr if a naim streamer/dac isn’t necessarily on your desired path?

I guess for me it comes down to that, going for an xpsdr, adding a node2i/hugo, treating the n272 as pre-amp only and be satisfied with that as the end game (or until a n373 comes out eventually (doubtful)).

At the moment, I think I am more comfortable with phasing the n272 out instantly, with a node 2i, hugo (q or 2), pre-loved 282/hicapdr, putting me on a path of choices (and future spending :clown_face:) and flexibility on sources and preamplification. The nd5x2 could be an option instead of node2i/hugo, but I owned the previous version and wasn’t too happy with the sound.

I will let it rest for now!

To my ears the ND5XS2 is a big improvement on its predecessor, which I found a bit lacklustre. It also opens the door to some better sounding material in the form of Qobuz 24 bit material and lossless iRadio. However, it’s still an XS level source, and with the Classic level amps on your shortlist, you really should be looking at a classic level source if you want a nicely balanced system. NDX2/XPSDR would be about the right level to aim for.
However, the much cheaper ND5XS2 does have a place in a Classic system if used via its SPDIF output into an offboard DAC (possibly the Hugo you are considering).

I just changed from 272/555DR to ND5XS2, nDAC/555DR, 252…

Adding 555dr to 272 is a very large upgrade in SQ.

Moving to separates as above was an even bigger improvement, which for me gives the sound I’ve looked for for 40 years of owning hifi systems.

I only stream, from Qobuz.

I use standard cables.

See vibration isolation thread for rack info.

I have been living under a rock and forgot about Brexit… add 25 to 30% to pre-loved purchases from the UK for us.

From various news reports, I understand that VAT will be automatically added by most couriers bringing goods into EU member states until post-Brexit customs/VAT issues have been resolved some time mid year (2021). It might be worth speaking to somebody at a customs office in your country of residence.

When I bought the NAC252 last year, I was worried that it might not be delivered before the end of December. It took a few phone calls to various customs clearance offices to find someone who was able to answer my questions and quote the relevant regulations. With help from Tom Tom in St. Albans, the pre-amp arrived here in December, so my fears of horrendous surcharges were unjustified.

If VAT is deducted by a UK seller, then your local rate of sales tax (or whatever it is called there) and possibly some import duties will probably be added.

I would make some calls and be persistent to find out if the additional costs really are 30% more than the UK advertised price.

Unfortunately, I checked already. UK items bought online are treated as all other non-eu items.

For instance, a pre-loved 282:
£2000
Shipping and Insurance Costs around £50
Import tax 4.5% - £ 92
Total - 2142
VAT 21% - 450
Total - £ 2592

Still. UK market remains appealing for pre owned Naim equipment even with this markup. Far more on offer than on the east side of the canal.

A very happy 272/XPSDR/300DR owner here. Still I’m thinking about if it would be worth the hassle in going 282/NDX2+XPSDR/300DR this year… If only one could demo such a system at home before buying it (second handed)… Anyone went that path?

I agree. On balance, you have to weigh up the potential mark-up and compare it with the relative merits of wider availability in the UK and the fact that reputable UK dealers know what Naim kit is capable of. Sadly, that level of Naim system expertise does not seem to be shared by as many dealers outside the UK. Indeed, many of them are just box shifters who will not do home demos and seem to be a bit inflexible on prices.

To avoid any jingoistic overtones, there are probably also dealers in the UK that are not up to scratch, either.

I have followed the advice and experience of other members here with dealers in the UK and so far I have not been disappointed at all.

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I have sadly learned these last few days that UK dealers are not willing to ship overseas at the moment due to brexit chaos at the ports. Unfortunate, but understandable.

A related question to my topic: I am about to close a deal on a 282/hcdr. When I have that installed, I will search for a new source. In the meantime, can I easily connect the n272 to the 282, using it just as a temporary streamer/dac? Could I then also use system automation to adjust the 282 volume with the 272?

If it’s essential for their revenue they’ll fix it shortly I’m sure. I’ve seen many UK retailers already removing UK VAT in the online stores for EU sales which means it won’t be that much of a difference. I assume it will get much better coming 6 months.

The 272 has a Line Out, so yes, you can conect it to a 282 input. You’ll need an RCA to 5 pin DIN cable.
As far as I’m aware, System Automation on a 272 only allows the control of a source device such as a Naim CD player, as it’s assumed that you will be using its built in preamp. I haven’t tried though, so you could always give it a try just in case I’m wrong! The required cable is very cheap, and it’ll come in handy when you get that NDX2!

Thank you. Isn’t the correct connection analogue out to in via din4-din5, as with a ndx2 being din5-din5?

I see the line out as well on the n272, but I thought that would not allow me to use volume regulation in the app.

Hello Chris. Slight diversion but is SPIDIF the same as BNC? I ask because I can only remember the ND5 having a BNC output.