Power supply Stage line depending on the cartridge?

Hi-Fi Corner
1

Hello community.

Actually the Planar 3 with a purple Elys 1 (2002 and have to change it) is connected to Naim Stage line N - Hicap to a Sudgen HA-4 (headphone amplifier used as Pre Out) and then in the Main In of the Rotel RA-980 BX.
Sound is quite amazing and thanks to Sudgen not dull, I would not like more details or to sound it more "harsh*.

But the Hicap has to return in my main system.
So my question, Hicap or Flatcap XS or even Hicap or Flatcap Olive ?
I do not want to lose any of the actual details.

Will a Flatcap suit more for one cartridge and the Hicap more for another one. My future cartridges will be MM around 200 GBP from Audotechnica, Dynavector, Grado, Ortofon, Goldring …
Should I just grab an olive Flatcap or Hicap I get for best price and how does the difference Flatcap Hicap or even olive serie (I only know Nat 02 from olive and I really like the sound) differ.
Thanks a lot.
Regards
Tvha

2

I had before a flatcap then an Hicap olive on Stageline. Preferred the Hicap olive.
But you need probably to think for a service on the Hicap.

3

Alternatively you could buy any pre-loved Naim integrated or pre/power that has the Aux2 input, and power the Stageline N from there. Practical, would save also on boxes, no FlatCap needed, and possible to sell some of the other stuff. SQ will probably be better also.

Some other thoughts regarding the well-known Rega system synergy:
If that’s a first Planar 3, from before the P3-2000 and RP3, then even a new P2 would be miles ahead. P3 much better still, and can be bought package-deal with a Rega Exact cartridge. Also, in that context and at that level of turntable, a Rega Fono MM directly into the Rotel is not a strange idea.

4

Thanks.
I’ll go the Sudgen way in the future.
I’ll get a fresh Hicap DR for my Stageline and a new cartridge.
I do not really like the Rega sound too much, so it’s good like this with a little Naim sound around. Another Naim amp : out of question :slight_smile:
Cheers

5

I’m not sure a £2,000 phono stage (Hicap DR and Stageline) makes any sense if you are limiting yourself to a £200 cartridge mounted on a vintage Rega 3. For that money a new Rega Planar 8 and a Rega Fono MM would be so much better.

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My P3 is from 2001 before euros. I’ll get the Hicap for 600 GBP. I have to find out if it is Sudgen bringing the good sound or the Hicap. So I can connect the stage line-Hicap to another RC-990 BX preamplifier from Rotel (disconnecting the Sudgen) or via the inbuilt RA-980 BX which I have not yet tried as I liked the result with the Sudgen. I forgot to try all that out.

I suppose it is the fantastic Sudgen actually and less the Hicap.
If that is the case I can reconsider leaving the Hicap and just getting a i-supply, or listening it through Rega. With a new cartridge a friend surely will lend me some of his 1.500 rock and metal records, so I will not have to spend any money for records.

Yes indeed a better Rega turntable would then be better.
If the stageline through a Aux 2 phono pre from a Naim amplifier is better than the stageline on a Hicap, well the combination Nac 282 Aux 2 with the stage line did not bring any result to my ears, but that could be the room or the Avantgarde Duo. A friend who is absolute vinylist just hated the sound and me too. I don’t remember if it was too bright or dull. It’s 7 years ago I found out it did not match. Since then the stageline was in its box in a drawer :slight_smile:

I would like a sound of my turntable leading more in the forward way, but not too much, so 75 % towards CD in comparison Vinyl-CD. My actual match with the Hicap is quite awesome. Why change. I will not become a vinylist. Ps: The stage line was a bargain as I got it as used for half price but it was new in box and the shop got ruined years after as they were “a little too friendly” with their customers. So I got all my Naim components new in box for arond 70 % of the new prices. So I can’t sell Naim audio, as lots of people recommended me, as I drove so far and so many times to collect it and so many memories I wanna keep, I would miss the beautiful design of the Nac 282.

Before getting a used VPI or a Bergmann turntable (that would be it) I’ll get a Sudgen A21 SE signature together with some awesome speakers, matching my 15 m2. But that’s not for now. I’m not yet 50 and such a package will be my birthday present :slight_smile:

7

One wise man in this forum said that Hicap olive and Hicap were absolutely identical inside until the DR version appeared and just the front cover would have changed. After that I found it easier to just get a Hicap whatever the front. So I can’t say what is the case when 2 trustful persons tell the opposite.

8

Thanks a lot for your ideas. P3 is from 2001 with purple Elys 1 (price was 650 eur but I paid not in eur, so it was before 2002) I prefer not buying any large components for now and had the experience Stageline via my Nac 282 and absolutely hated it and the bad surprise hit me very hard as I expected something mindblowing. So changing the cartridge with my RB 300 Tonearm will not sound as good as buying a new P2. So design, tonearm matters and not only the cartridge. Interesting. I thought upgrading the cartridge would go towards a P6. Regards

9

I think you misunderstood my post. I said that I preferred the Hicap olive vs the black flatcap on the Stageline.

10

I myself can’t reflect how I could have understood your post in such a wrong manner. Yes I completely misunderstood, sorry for that.

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No problem. It happens to me often :grin:

12

After this Stageline thread and your thread on the NAT02, both related to the HiCap, I’m sure several of us are curious about what direction you want to go exactly. You did explain some of it above, but at least to me it’s not really clear.

Do I understand correctly that you have a main system and a secondary system? Main system being 282/250 with HiCap with CDX2/XPS2 source and Sudgen/Grado head-fi and speakers? Second system then being Rega P3-2000/Elys, Stageline/(another)HiCap, Rotel amp and speakers? NAT02 and a Rega Dac in there also? Or is that all mixed and matched into one system?

Definitely lots of streamlining and improvement possible in that whole collection, but, again, dependent on where you want to go and on what budget. Have you sorted out the basics, like a Fraim support which is appropriate for this level of Naim? Is vinyl just a temporary or fun source, or do you want to elevate that to a more important source? Not everyone likes the Stageline but have you also heard it with a much better turntable? One or two systems? Sticking to CD or moving (also) to streaming? With internet radio to replace FM? Stacking because of no room for boxes if I read correctly so do you want to reduce the box count?

Lots of questions! Looking forward to hearing your grand scheme of things after these first encounters. Enough experience-based knowledge available on this forum to help you if you want.

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Hello and thank you for your interest. As in this forum and a very nice man in Pink Fish Media helped me already out, my decision is taken. Lots of people from different forums want me to get rid of all my Naim and keep the horn speakers, others want me to keep Naim and get rid of the horn speakers.
Well I will not get rid of anything. Who that does not please, shall not read further. I will: 1. install Rega turntable wall mount 2. get a power supply for Stage line and insert the Hicap back where it belongs (main Naim) 2. New cartridge Then in some years: New amp (Sudgen A21 SE signature) and amazing speakers fitting “whatever” amp I bought.
Finally before I die: get a dream turntable when I’m old and very weak with a dream cartridge because every hifi fan loves the view of a nice turntable and some say: “your P3 is an old wreck” . If I listen to music, I listen 6 records in a roll and after 3 records, I already am mad at getting up and turn the record, so I need the comfort of 50-76 min of music in a roll, I’m a lazy fart I suppose.

Yes you are totally right. I have my “dream” Naim in the living room where I, now, after 9 years, could finally listen to music again at “emotion” level → cf historic following Hicap is a part of the main system I now took out and am not able to drive it anymore … for very short as I will fit it back in … when the Stage line has its power supply.

The Sudgen headphone pre-amplifier is now part of my 2nd Rotel system … because I have Tinnitus and headphone is out of question → I use it as a pre-amplifier as it is meant for that too (1600 GBP retail price)

I’m testing out now 4 different pairs of speakers: B&W DM 601 S2, DM 580, DM 100i, DM 302 and will get rid of 3 pairs in the future.

As I have the Rega turntable mounting rack, I will install it !
I do not intend to become a vinylist, it’s for fun and pleasure only and a vinylist friend will surely lend me some of his 1500 records if he knows that my cartridge is new and that I will take care and get experience in how to handle records. 60% of my 120 records actually are in a bad shape and I still am a CD’ist.

The Hicap I will buy cannot be used for my Naim Nat02 !, but also for my Nac 282 as it improves sound in “soundstage” from a 10/20 (1 Hicap)
to a 14/20 (2 Hicaps). As I can’t lift heavy and have lack of room, I like narrow gear, and watch out for a low cost Hicap, recapped or not, whatever.

I found a batgain Hicap DR in the net but I do not trust the owner, no risk, lots of fun.

Main system is: Nac 282/ Nap 250 / Hicap / Nat 05 XS / CDX2.3 / XPS 2/ Avantgarde Duo G1

Second system is: cf youtube videos “the vintage hifi ambassador”
After 15 times of remodeling, the 2 systems will now stay like this for some years. And yes the Rega Dac is used for streaming with Apple TV 3 and especially for listening to my Rotel RCD-971, which I begin to appreciate again.

I better not mention my 3rd listening room with Revox and a Rotel pre/power combi :slight_smile: when I enjoy my 2nd main (of 7) hobbies → cf My own private repair café and technical RC service center - YouTube (cool the link works)

As acousically spoken my main listening room is suboptimal, I only listen to classical music and jazz and that’s ok as I found the solution to

→ listen to rock and metal and of course fabulous classic and jazz on FM on my Nat 02 … why I enjoy more the Nat 02 in my 2nd (bedroom) listening room? → because of the huge traffiic noise in my living-room untin 23:00 so I am a nightwatcher and my life in peace begins after 23:00 until late in the morning before I go to sleep.

So I enjoyed the Nat 05 XS the last 9 years “sporadically” when the Naim mains got current which was not very often → cf historic

As I only have the Nat 02 for 15 months, I enjoyed it in the living room when traffic was peaceful

And now why changing the listening sessions mainly into the 2nd room?
Why now? What did change. Well simple: all the neighbours changed: 1 musician above me instead of 2 babies and strict parents not liking my music … and new lovely neighbours at my side, that I even can listen to music at “emotion” level late at night

No, I do not want a house as I have too many health problems.

HISTORIC:
The purchase of Naim gear 11 years ago was when my neighbours were a very old lady in the side apartment, near deaf, a nice couple above me who were often out and under me a rich belgian fellow who was there only 2x/year. So I got the gear and the only minor thing was that the bass sounded awful because of the floor. Jazz sounded only a little better compared to now as the room was 10 m2 bigger but rock or metal never sounded good because of Naim-horn combination.

The Hi-Fi waited for around 9 years now as after I listened to my main system once with a sing song writer from Germany (Natas loves you), my neighbour (side apartment) a doctor rang at my door, looked me in the face around 19:00 o’clock and said: “Come on, what’s that for”. So I respected him and very sporadicly only listened to jazz or classic at very low volume as only after 23:00 the traffic noise does no more disturb me.

Then my neighbour over me with 2 babies in the apartment over my head did not accept any music, so again I did only listen carefully and the new doctor is much more understandable and his wife, also a doctor (side apartment) sometimes listened very loud music at Saturdays and she told me she does not hear very well.

So now without babies over my head, without a doctor knocking at my door I could listen loud, and since beginning of pandemy I have a slight tinnitus because of Lotus alarm with closed garage. So last chance to enjoy Hifi as I do not know what the Tinnitus will become. I could get a house but that’s so much work, so I do not want one. After pandemy I will sell around 20 hifi components and perhaps I will be in the mood to ask a specialist to help me out finding the best fitting high end gear and changing my listening rooms. We’ll see.

Now it’s time to listen to the music at a level where my Tinnitus is glad and where the former doctor would already ring at my door as music is emotion, and emotions demand a certain level of volume !
Hope it was long enough as I have time and my 9 fingers still work quite fine.

I’m open for any more questions.
Regards

14

That will also save you a lot of forum time then! :grin:

So much clearer now, thank you. Good to hear you’ve found the way forward.

A really nice first system and playing around with the other systems (also for the YouTube channel) must be fun. Fraim for the main system might be a consideration for the future. Take care!

15

Hello daddycool

Well I have a Solidsteel 5 shelves rack which I bought in 2001 with the turntable.
It’s definately harder than the Naim fraim :slight_smile:
Take care too. Peace & music

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