What an odd, pedantic point to make. What has who he was physically signed to got to do with the clubs he’s moved through?
Signed for City academy. Slightly more on topic he was sent out to Accrington with no intent of him signing but to play in so-called “men’s football”. Whilst he was much talked up he played behind a back 4 and ended up being dropped twice for poor form including a sequence in which they shipped 12 goals in 3 games. Trafford has subsequently talked of being a scapegoat but that was rather undone by John Coleman some years later, after he heard Trafford’s claim, highlighting the specific handling, decision making, kicking and throwing errors which cost 7 of those 12 goals. Coleman had an opportunity to extend the loan if he guaranteed Trafford would be back in the team. He refused and so back he went.
At Bolton he kept a record 26 clean sheets but was behind a cohesive and mean back 3, which dropped to a 5 when out of possession. Famously had Connor Bradley making a huge impression too. Even at Bolton he was dropped for errors though. They’d have maybe signed him but couldn’t afford to and City wanted another look in Academy and Youth games.
City took him back but decided that what looked good in 3-5-2 didn’t really work in 4-3-3/3-2-5 after seeing him once again play for them. He made a mostly positive impression but it was noted that his positional awareness during his 17 first team games and those other games was still problematic.
The sale to Burnley was genuinely interesting. Under Kompany he played a unique role behind a back 4 where he was effectively an outfield player in a 5. Under Parker he was part of a rigid 4.
The latter persuaded City that maybe he could play in a 4 so they bought him back but realised quickly that the same flaws had been hidden by the sheer rigidity of the Parker approach, which had a 1 in front of the 4. Thus, Donnarumma and the sale to a club who play the only formation he’s excelled in.
I stand by my point. He was repeatedly moved on because of his struggles to play behind a 4 and because there’s always an error in him when pressured.
1 - by all means go re-read about your “recollection”. The posts are all still there. I was the poster who noted that Norwich, with a limited budget, needed defensive mids but Farke brought in attacking mids, kept them for the PL and was relegated in consequence. Didn’t learn the lesson, twice. Plainly wasn’t playing 2 defensive mids at the time.
2 - I make a clear reference to McKenna adapting as Ipswich arrived in the Championship from League One. The evidence for that being the arrival of Keiffer Moore. I made no reference I can see to him adapting to the PL.
3 - Get the stats right. Trafford is 2nd in the Opta shots stopped in all competitions. He’s not even top 5 for the PL last season and, as someone rightly pointed out, stopping a shot is not quite the same as stopping a goal if what you do is stop the shot but put the ball into an area which subsequently results in a goal. Sourced that from a Leeds United fan club account on Facebook if you’re wondering but it’s Opta so it’s not really difficult to get the actual data.
Apologies for points 1 and 2 merely “dragging out” what is already on the forum.
I do appreciate it’s really hard to suppress your dislike for a poster on occasion and so easy to let it get in the way of a grown up discussion of the merits of a player based on actual history.
Do feel free to burn through all that anger and energy proving me wrong yet again. It’s hugely entertaining.
Yes my point was that he’s played for several clubs and each has highlighted issues with his game. Your point, as to who actually owns him, seems entirely unrelated.
If Trafford was good in a 3-5-2, then that will suit Leeds as that is what Farke seems to have primarily settled for as a starting shape - you have to give him credit for changing it half way through the season and that it was pretty successful and kept us up. Trafford can’t be any worse that the last few keepers we have had but I do worry if he can dominate the box.
I think Farke is underrated and I really hope he is successful with Leeds. At some point, like all managers, he will be moved on/sacked - you can then say “I told you so” Mike!!
My point was indeed that Leeds have signed him because he works best in a 3/5 but that doesn’t make it a given he’ll be an improvement on what they’ve had so far, largely because Farke teams aren’t generally super compact at the back but also because he has some very obvious weaknesses.
At the point Farke goes it will either be because he gets Leeds relegated despite being given decent resources or is perceived to have under-achieved given those resources. That will be because of tactical mistakes. That in part would support my view that he’s not really a PL quality manager but… we’ll see.
Trafford will turn out to be a good signing for Leeds. Or he won’t. I, personally, am pleased Newcastle didn’t sign him. But he is a “statement signing” for Leeds. A perceived top class international and a real show that Leeds are serious. Fair play. What is dispiriting, is sniping fans from lower league teams infiltrating this thread and having a pop. Come on Mike. You’re better than that. #benice
I literally said “Will help to some degree with the style of football Farke wants to play but he’s not an upgrade as a keeper and the reasons he keeps moving on are clear enough.”
I’m comfy standing by every word of that and we’ll see how it plays out. It was and is my honest opinion on Trafford. Decent shot stopper with flaws as a lot of elite keepers are nowadays.
For the sake of clarity I’ll say Trafford is an upgrade on Meslier. The distance between Trafford and Darlow is not as great as people might expect or want it to be though. There’s a huge distance between them on distribution but Darlow barely loses on % of shots and several other metrics. What Leeds have bought is different, may be better for them, but not necessarily better.
Two responses to that opinion have been in significant part about the poster not the post. The rules of the forum prohibit further comment so let’s not get sucked into such nonsense. On that basis I’ll ignore the “lower league teams”. Technically accurate, but un-needed and ironic in the context of suggesting I’ve been “having a pop.”
The comment I find interesting is at the end when it says that Real have been strengthened by their summer signings and then it lists Ibrahim Konate! After watching him last year, I am not sure that is much of a strengthening??
But Vini does seem to have used the Arsenal interest to get himself a new deal, not sure what the financial upside is for him but I assume it isnt a small raise…
I don’t think so but let’s say we have the thing with being played is that the decoy has to be believable there is no point Vini Jnr strolling into Perez’s office all cocky and saying if you don’t improve that contract I’m off to the Spuds.
Was he ever serious who knows but one thing we do know is that unless Real improved on the offer that’s been sitting there 7 months he couldn’t have accepted and so it was only right however small the chance that Arsenal where in position to step in.
I’ve been laughed at for selling Van Persie, when Fabregas won titles with Chelsea, for losing a Europa League final 5-1 to Chelsea, for finishing 8th, for signing Mustafi, for signing Sterling so am I bothered that I’ll be laughed at because we tried to sign Vini Jnr and that he and his agents thought Real would believe Arsenal were a serious option for him.
And this isn’t aimed at you @mikehughescq but to the supporters of numerous sh**t clubs who will point and laugh, laugh away.
No worries, I wouldn’t have taken it as having a go at me. I do think there’s a tendency to laugh at the club who may have been played without ever taking on board that you do indeed have to be big enough/significant enough/pay enough to be credibly in the mix.
No laughter from me. Clubs don’t get a say in who plays them. I just find it reprehensible that players and their agents behave like this and on a lesser scale it’s been eye opening to see my own club dragged into such shenanigans whether it was bringing Bale out of retirement, signing every older PL player who wanted a late career pay rise or TalkSport making up crisis meetings which never happened.
The Arsenal owners across multiple sports are very successful and if they put together the kind of package that Vini Jnr’s representatives knew would force Real into offering more money then they would have taken everything into account including pay structure.
They have used a similar pattern at all their clubs a young coach builds a successful squad which they then add superstars too so don’t be surprised in the next couple of season if more attempts/purchases like this happen.
I think Arsenal have been played. But, it’s not really their fault. It could have happened to any club.
However, I think they may have been naiive… Vinicius would have had no interest in moving to the Prem. Like I said before, he knows he couldn’t get away with half of his dark arts diving and whining to the ref.
Technically accurate, but un-needed and ironic in the context of suggesting I’ve been “having a pop.”