Think we all know the answer to that. 
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Getting back to service charges, I think the attitude in North America, being well aware of what restaurant workers wages are, is that if you can’t afford a 15-20% tip, then maybe you can’t afford to eat out.
I’d generally tip up to 10 percent usually in cash in a restaurant. If the bill comes with a service charge and is commensurate with the service I’ll pay if not I’ll ask them to remove it and I’ll in pay cash as to what I feel is worthy.
Going out to eat should be a pleasurable experience and I don’t want to be worrying about how much the goods have been marked up. Obviously we all grumble about it and how much the markup is but that’s life.
I’ve several colleagues in the takeaway / restaurant business and they all say running these sort of establishments is financially gruelling. The cost of gas for example. Catering fridges / chill blasters for example aren’t cheap. If that breaks in the middle of day / night and requires repairing immediately or god forbid needs replacing. Rectifying these issues comes with premium costs.
The markup on the food and drink pays for the licence so you can listen to fine music (hopefully), the sound / pa system, the pretty chairs one sits on, the handsome baubles that dangle from the ceiling, the designed lighting and attractive art works on the wall. Etc etc
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I find the music is for the benefit of the staff or owners.
The number of times recently I have gone out to eat and had to ask the establishment to turn down the music. In fact I wish they would turn it off.
When I go out to eat I want to eat and have a good conversation why oh why would you want to listen to music in a restaurant fine music or not.
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The French system seems by far the best to me. Service is included and you leave a few coins if you are happy with everything. If you don’t have any coins it’s no problem either. Worrying about whether to add 10%, asking for a charge to be removed etc etc is unnecessary angst. Going out for a meal should be a simple and enjoyable thing.
One thing that gets me in the U.K. is that restaurants often expect you to buy overpriced bottled water. We always ask for tap water, and that does seem to be getting more common and the scowly looks less frequent. There is a local restaurant where they only give you tap water in glasses. If you ask for a jug they simply refuse. So every time you finish the glass you have to ask for another one. It’s a right pain, especially if you drink lots of water with a meal, which we do.
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Ambience?
I suppose we have fine hifi at home to listen to music 
I agree, other than sometimes some very low level music to slightly mask the emptiness if the restaurant is not busy.
The worst thing is fast music - is a ploy to make you eat up fast and free up the table.
On a related subject, one small local restaurant we visited at lunchtime not long after they opened, had very nice food, and we had a very pleasant meal chatting with a friend. They were reasonably busy but not full. On the strength of that we went back one evening a few months later, at a time when it was packed, and possibly being evening people very possibly were drinking more - the consequence was such a level of background noise that we couldn’t enjoy a conversation with our friends. The place had hard surfaces all round with nothing soft to absorb sound, and was simply acoustically awful, the space working with limited noise source, but became overwhelming when busy. We did not return, and they closed after a couple of years.
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One thing that gets restaurants in the UK is expecting things for free. No one chooses tapwater over mineral water unless they’re on a strict budget or tight. If you’re on a strict budget, choose a cheaper establishment, then you don’t have the enormous burden of ‘overpriced’ (here we go again) water and having to think about a tip.
P.S. With your condition, I presume you’d expect lovely clean toilets as per one of your other threads. Perhaps they should charge separately for that and then bring the menu costs down?
Any restaurant that has that attitude deserves to go under, and making light of bowel conditions is beneath you. It may not occur to you that we avoid bottled water for environmental reasons. Shipping water hundreds or thousands of miles in heavy glass bottles is ridiculous. We don’t drink it at home and try to avoid it wherever possible when out. So it’s nothing whatsoever about being tight.
The point I was making was about the U.K. In France, bread and water are brought to the table almost automatically. You get a good meal, service is included and it’s a far better experience.
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Erm, yes they do. I like tap water. Even if I am paying £200+ a head, I will choose tap water.
Some people prefer to pay for poncy bottle presented water that in some cases is actually the same water, other times differs only in trace element content (which may be higher or lower in different elements), while bottled water, at least in UK and EU countries, may legally have higher bacteria counts than bottled, though I don’t think about these things at the time of asking for water, simply liking tap water.
The best restaurants simply provide water free, and did before the recent move towards requiring tap water to be available upon request… (Pretentious ones charge the earth.)
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Damn don’t know where that leaves us we prefer sparkling water.
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I perhaps should have used a lengthier explanation. I don’t want to put anything that is going to offend. I based my comment on an explanation given to me by the people involved. That waiting staff were not considered “worthy” of a decent basic wage. The indignity of needing to chase a customer to get a tip or have no income horrifies me.
Despite the assertion that the British do not tip, I have grown up with that as the norm. Whilst young, eating out meant lunchtime meals in cafes or tea and a cake in the afternoon, parents, grandparents would slip some coins under the saucer once the bill was paid. I was probably mid teens before evening eating was a thing and then it was Berni restaurants.
So yes, I want happy staff, will tip and to me just as important, say thank you.
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this could be a good purchase for some just out in Decanter
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You’re stuck with the bottled kind …unless the restaurant has a “Sodastream” or draught version carbonating the tap water.
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We went for lunch at a very nice local restaurant, 36 on the Quay a couple of weeks ago. They had a star under the previous chef and the quality is very high. We had a jug of water, as did virtually every table. As soon as it was empty it got refilled by one of the very friendly staff. A nice bottle of Viognier went down very well with the lunch. It cost around £100 for the two of us.
We were so happy with it that we’ve booked for their seven course tasting menu one evening in November. They are very happy to tweak the menu to omit any meat, and didn’t bat an eyelid when we asked. They can provide seven accompanying wines for a very reasonable £55 - I’m saying that to me that’s good value, rather than me being tight, in case anyone gets the wrong idea.
If they’d been remotely sniffy about water, we wouldn’t be going back so soon. But they weren’t, and we are.
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Not sure if you remember, but we have something in common. Not making light, perfect example of costs.
Not wishing to go off topic, you should be taking VSL3 and you don’t take it with tapwater containing chlorine/chloramine and on top of that, tapwater isn’t exactly the best for your fragile gut.
What’s ridiculous is exaggerating the shipping ‘100 times around the globe in glass bottles’. A lot of the UK’s water is quite local (Harrogate, Buxton,…) and the glass/plastic bottles are recycled.
P.S. To the person who keeps replying to me and liking HH post, you were ignored years ago, so you’re wasting your time. I just see a grey circle.
er, I never order bottled water and (on occasion eat in very nice restaurants) like many, I choose tap water due to environmental reasons, not because I’m on a strict budget or ‘tight’ - what a weird thing to suggest.
I said hundreds or thousands of miles, not hundreds of times around the globe. Obviously bottles can be recycled, but it’s so much better to avoid them in the first place. Anyway, it’s a decision for each of us. I’ll take a look at VSL3, thanks.
“exaggerating the shipping ‘100 times around the globe” my humour lost.
VSL3 or Vivomixx. Same product, Vivomix generally get slightly cheaper. 12 years ago some specialists said helps, some said no difference. Last one I saw a year ago asked if I was taking anything and I said VSL3. He replied that’s good. I was surprised. Maybe they’re changing their view? You should look at it.
Completely unreasonable, and insulting, generalisation. In our part of the UK tap water is palatable, indistinguishable from bottled waters and would be our choice. Nothing to do with cost whatsoever, just that we don’t drink wine, and I don’t see the point of bottled/branded still water if it is indistinguishable from eau d’tap. The environmental issues are a factor too. If the tap water is foul then we’d pay the premium for bottled water I suppose, much as you might buy a better wine if the ‘house’ carafe is horrible.
I think people who pay anything for wine, let alone upwards of £50 are utterly bonkers but there you go. YMMV.
Bruce
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