Roon and Naim Streamers (Choices and Problems)

Any compatibility issues with Roon and WD NAS systems?

Roon can access multiple drives on your network, but to be fair, so can most UPnP servers, so this is not a USP! Not that I mean to criticise Roon, what is does, it seems to do very well in my experience, and in a very user friendly way.

Do you guys use HQPlayer with Roon? If so, how do you like it?

I am currently on the 14-day Roon trial and find that the Roon sounds slight worse than the Linn Kazoo into my Linn Klimax (with Katalyst), so I am looking for way to make it sound at least as good as the sound directly from the Linn Kazoo,

I have a music library of approx 22k local tracks add a few thousand virtual tracks, and use an iMac/OS X to run Roon Core in the background and it’s absokutely fine, navigation is effectively instant. I have Roon Core Access my media share NAS over the Ethernet using DNS… it all works perfectly… including DSP on DSD which seems to be the most relatively CPU demanding…

I am at 81k tracks stored locally, of which just half are 24-bit PCM/DSD64/MQA. Roon Core is running on a NUC5i3 using ROCK, and runs just fine, responsive, new tracks added instantly etc.
It will perform format conversion of DSD128 & DSD256 down to DSD64, and PCM 24/384 (DXD) to 24/192, so basically plays everything I want, through the Sonore UPnP bridge to NDS/555DR network player.
At only 15W TDP the processor will be staying relatively cool for the majority of the time, normal streaming, so the Fan won’t be kicking it.
The i5 and particularly the i7 NUC will generate much more heat, needing the standard fan on more often, given the size of case and thermodynamic properties.

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Advice please for NDS with Roon. I would really apreciate it. I am a total layman so would appreciate simplicity

I want to us Roon as I am very disaitisfied with Naim app.

How do I set this up?

I have a Sunology NAS DS218j, NDS and Minimac

My questions are these:
Core questions:

  1. Can I run Roon on the NAS ? I understand that Roon core should be on a SSD which I could add, however is there enough RAM on the DS218j? I think not…unfortunately as it does not have enough RAM and Armada 385 processor
  2. My Minimac is 2011, CPU 2.Ghz i5 with 8GB Ram but has no SSD; could I run the core on this as it has no SSD?
  3. So if I cannot use these what is the cheapest option: I see Wilco recommended SONICTRANSPORTER I5? Or should I just buy anoth minimac so I can use it for other things

Roon talking to my NDS

  1. How do I get the Roon RAAT to communicate with uPnp to my NDS. I understand that there are various devices for this?
  2. Can this all be done without altering the SQ?

Thanks in advance, this is a bit of nightmare and all driven from frustration with the Naim app.

To be honest to get the most out of Roon you might need to upgrade your streamer. The way Roon works it (can) distribute 32 bit stereo samples to the end points via Ethernet, which is how it works with the new streamers.

With the old streamers you would need a RAAT client that downsamples the media to 24 bit to then distribute via UPnP or SPDIF to your NDS … and if the latter the quality of the client will become pivotal to the overall SQ performance and so you will need a precision device to get the best from it.

I think using any of these downsampling client methods is going to give a slight hit on SQ, unless you disable all the media processing and conditioning aspects of Roon Core which is a big part of it.

If you run a subset of the Roon Core features without any of the media processing or conditioning, you will probably fine running on a NAS if supported. To get the most from Roon Core you will need to run on faster processors with floating point arithmetic units like the higher IntelCore iSeries processors

Thanks…so yes I need to know that RAAT client. If my NDS only accepts 24 bit (does it?) then surely I will not notice any difference

I am happy to disable anny media processing or conditioning…I think? What do you acutally mean? Please remember I am a total layman in this.

Simon, can you explain how you set up the 32 bit and/or show a screenshot of the signal path with the 32 bit information showing?

I’ve noticed you mention this a few times but have never noticed it mentioned on the Roon forum.

Thanks, John.

.sjb

Ah, I see it in device setup. What difference do you think 24 vs 32 bit will make. As said above I’ve rarely seen it mentioned let alone emphasised on the Roon forum.

.sjb

Roon will run fine from a HDD, from what hardware you have the Mac mini is probably your best bet. (The music can be accessed from the nas where I presume it’s stored).

Your best bet to trial Roon is direct connection from Mac mini to NDS - I think the mini has the choice of optical out?

If you then liked Roon you could get the Sonore UPnP bridge which will allow you to move the Mac away from the hifi and connect to the NDS via Ethernet. @simon.pepper uses this very effectively and from my experience using it with a UniQute it works better when the unit it is playing to has no volume function. (NDS).

As you can see from my question to Simon I’m not aware of any great claims for 32 bit vs 24.

.sjb

I think it only comes into play if you use the sanple processing DSP engine. Effectively otherwise you are taking say 16 or 24 bit sample data, expanding it to 64 bit floating in Roon Core (DSP) then resembling down to 24 bit for transport to the olde genereation Naim Streamer, for it to expand again for its digital low pass filtering forthe DAC.
The 32 bits transport of RAAT is going to minimise the extent of numeric rounding errors and quantisation errors … what will this sound like in practice… probably be almost undetectable to be honest… but it is a consideration especially if Roon volume control is utilised.

FWIW I love the Roon integration with new streamer displays… really useful to get a visual cue of artist or album art when playing Roon playlists… love it :grinning:

I have to admit, owning a Hugo TT as I do, your enthusiasm for the NDX2 into Hugo is spiking my interest. Naim seem to have nailed the signal integrity via Ethernet from what I can gather.

I may like the display more than I think (it can be turned off, can’t it?) but a remote to pause and skip etc. is one thing I miss since moving to Roon.

.sjb

Great; mnay thanks

Please advise what I need to purchase to set up the Sonore UPnP bridge?

Thanks to you all this forum is truly a magnificent friendly source of info.

I shall now take Simon’s advice and experiment with the Minimac

Not completely off when playing … not currently… but you can get it to display a clock instead which is not obtrusive.
And yes the NDX2 remote controls the Roon play list for replaying and skipping tracks…

Simon, I have been trying Roon on an Innuos box and liking it. I see the various things under Settings. Which ones in the settings are you referring to. Are any of them extension such as HQ Player?

Thanks in Advance

Phil

On the Roon client display… press the speaker icon at the bottom right of the screen for the device playing out… then press on the DSP icon that becomes visible… then you have whole group of options.
All these bit manipulation functions are processed by the Core for a specific end point… so your settings for your Naim can be quite different from say your Airplay devices.

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Wow…I am completely sold…_

Please advise what I need to purchase to set up the Sonore UPnP bridge?_…I need to buy this asap!

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I am sorry I can’t advise, I am not familiar with those devices. But I can say a second generation Naim streamer works very well with Roon and sounds fantastic too

Hi Davidr,

I believe you can run Roon just fine on your Mac Mini. Mine is very similar, perhaps one iteration newer, and Roon handles upsampling/DSP/etc without breaking a sweat. Let the NAS just store your local media.

I recently discovered the Sonore UPnP Bridge software which allows Roon to “push” music to any UPnP endpoint such as your NDS. I have a NAC-N 272, but the same principle applies.

There are various hardware choices which can run the Sonore UPnP Bridge such as Sonore devices (e.g. microrendu, ultrarendu), Small Green Computer and (here in the UK) Audiostore (formerly known as Vortexbox).

So I chose an Audiostore Mite so that I have local support.

The Mite is essentially a tiny computer running a dedicated audio operating system called SonicOrbiter OS (I believe Audistore have slightly modified it). The Mite is very easy to use. It simply requires power and a wired connection to your network. Setup is fairly simple. I had one issue when the Mite couldn’t detect my 272 but was quickly resolved by reinstalling the Sonore UPnP Bridge app.

So, if this the route you want to take, all you need to buy is the Audiostore Mite and follow the instructions here. Within Roon, you setup the Mite as a Squeezebox Lite device.

I’ve been using this setup for a couple of days and seems to be going well.