You raise a valid point here about modularity and the ability to refine the vinyl source beyond the initial budget outlay.
If you go the Rega route as many have, myself included, you tend to stick with what you’re given (including a factory fitted cartridge in most cases) and replace the whole deck as your budget and expectations grow.
An entry level Majik LP12 busts the £2k budget at £2930 new (UK retail list price) but gives you a wealth of opportunity to tinker with it to heady heights of performance over an extended period of ownership.
I’m actually evaluating a return to a LP12 based setup consolidating 2 Rega decks down to one LP12 with a evolution path in mind for similar reasons.
Dealer tuned good examples can be had at acceptable initial outlay cost wise.
There´s (per definition ) one belt classical only - Linn Sondek LP12 prices for a new and naked one (no psu, no tonearm, no cartridge) are starting at round about 1700 pounds.
Indeed ! That what makes me think twice before going with Rega. Also agraa with Don that Linn is a great TT which gives various upgrade routes. Is entry level Majik is good ? Or mid range Akurate/Lingo will be huge step up ?
In the past had some experience with first variant of VPI Scout. For the money was a great TT.
In my case the reasoning is having owned a few suspension based turntables in the past including an LP12 and as it stood at that time, whilst I had a mind to evolve the LP12 with component swaps and refinements, had neither the time nor budget to take it sufficiently far to warrant holding on to it and let it go and focused primarily on CD playback and had a Rega which was more modest (P3 24) but still gave me a “good enough” source when I felt I wanted to dip in to vinyl playback.
In the years that followed I went through 4 different Naim CD players, complimented them with an ND5 XS then went towards Chord DAC’s then back to ND5 XS2 and now NDX2.
I also added an RP6 to the mix and kept the P3 24 for a second system and more occasional use, by then I had a little more listening time as required for vinyl vs digital but wasn’t in a position to take a serious look at a more longer term vinyl source journey.
I’ve simplified my main system setup now and recently consolidated my second AV centric system around a Linn Selekt DSM which initially can support the RP6 with an analogue MM input and later can support an LP12 with a Urika II over Exakt Link direct in to the DSM.
I won’t be able to make the leap towards an Akurate level LP12 up front but know even with a new or dealer tuned Majik level LP12 I’ll have all I need to plug and play and later over time evolve it towards a higher level of performance.
I’m intending to do exactly the same with the Selekt DSM which starts as a 2 channel integrated and will become a 5.1 capable HDMI enabled AV hub to replace the previous Arcam based system.
Even that initially will run alongside the Arcam amp and act as the front channels with a Unity Gain input from the Arcam AV amp.
As to what the progression through the LP12 configurations brings to the capability of the source, I’m yet to fully establish that from a personal perspective but I am well aware of what the entry point and the end game LP12 is capable of having heard both many times in similar or equivalent systems to the ones I have at home.
Your point about Majik LP12 vs similar price point alternatives is an interesting one, I guess it depends on if you want a plug and forget deck like a Rega 8 or even a 10, both very capable and well respected, or if you want to adjust as you go and take the source ultimately beyond what either a Rega 8 or 10 are capable of in a stock configuration.
I imagine you’ll find a reasonable number of members on here that have all of these configurations and enjoy them for what they are and what they add to their system as a whole. It’s really down to how much more you expect to be able and willing to do with your initial investment after the fact and over a longer period of time.
Having now acquired and lived with two different Rega decks and enjoyed them for what they are, I find them a bottleneck now in that to take them further they need to be replaced hence the appeal of an alternative approach based on the LP12 which offers the level of configurability I now find myself in a position to take full advantage of both in terms of budget and available listening time to maximise the return on the more significant investment.
My guess is that you could certainly get enjoyable replay for £2000, but if you will be content at that level is hard for anybody but you to predict. Given the mentioned amplification IMO you could allocate considerably more before the amp becomes an obvious bottleneck.
For new at £2000 I would probably listen to Rega, Well tempered and Clearaudio. Not sure what the entry Vertere is but suspect a bit more? (heard the next level up, very nice!).
The Vertere DG-1 with MM cartridge is £2,850, comes with interconnect but no phone stage.
Such a good question as I’m in a similar position (52 and 135s); but rather than buy new, and I was thinking of a Rega, I have decided to buy second hand LP12 from a reputable dealer.
(Pictures to follow …)
Thanks, that’s a well defined and coherent case for the LP12 , I have A Clearaudio and I think the arm and cartridge can be cannibalised for a more expensive base.
Something that can happen with a Rega , but very rarely.
Out of pure interest, where does the modern LP12 lie in respect of equivalent sound performance compared to other alternatives?
For example (and I’m sure others will be far more qualified to establish) …
Majik LP12 (Adikt) - Rega P6/Ania
Akurate LP12 (Krystal) - Rega P8/Apheta3
Klimax (Kandid) - Rega P10/Aphelion2
Without additional upgrades and taking the respective Linn “level” as they initially intended (without any extra Linn upgrades); are these fair equivalents or does the LP12 surpass each of them?
Well put Mr.Frogg
Be interesting to see what thoughts come through based on listening experiences
I soon will upgrade to 252/SC, now i am using Well Temprered Amadeus Mkii and i plan to keep it. I believe its a excellent source but if i was starting again i would search for a turntable that is easier to use (turntables like Linn, my own WTL and others often are not easy to use) and more premium looks with similar sound quality. My current favorite candidates are Luxman PD-151 or PD 171, Technics more premium turntables and similar.
I think that a number of people might have done the Majik/ P6 comparison… but once committed either way, less will have dome the other two. Klimax LP12 comparison is very difficult as in its ultimate implementation the analogue output will be digitised, go through SO and then converted back to analogue. This required a largely Linn system.
Also consider that Malik now come with Karusel and also has replaced the project arm with a new. So I guess old conclusion might not hold anymore…
(where I live a P8 match the price of a Linn Majik better than P6)
While you are facing changes in tonearm, sub-chassis, cartridge and motor unit on Linn side you´ll get significant changes in plinth, cartridge and tonearm on Rega side. But … the devil is in the details:
-> Majik LP12 = synchronous motor with a capacitor for phase shifting and Majik tonearm beeing a variant of well known Jelco SA-250 and Adikt MM cart. Quality of PSU can be evaluated to be below the psu used on Rega P6 with positive effects on wow and flutter to be counted in for the Rega P6.
When it comes to tonearm and cart I would also count in more points on Pro side for RB330 applying tracking force dynamically what will reduce variation of used contact space between needle and grove while playing and result in lower distortion level.
-> Akurate LP12 = synchronous motor with Lingo 4 PSU beeing far superior to Majik PSU and Akito 3 tonearm paired with Krystal cart well known to be superior to Adikt and Majik tonearm either. Furthermore it comes with Kore subchassis
Linn takes a high effort in Lingo 4 PSU by generating the 50Hz/ 60Hz sinus that defines accurate speed of the motor. Rega P8 PSU equals to somewhat in between Valhalla/ Herkules and Lingo.
When it comes to the tonearm I would also rate the RB880 with again applying the tracking force dynamically a bit higher as the Akito. But I know very lively what good and high performer the Akito can be when paired with a matching cartridge and when its sound is the only thing that counts.
-> Klimax LP12 = Keel , Ekos SE, Radikal, Urika and Kandid actually form a record player from another planet.
The effect of the Keel sub-chassis should not be underestimated; the Ekos tonearm also applies the tracking force dynamically like the large Rega tonearms; Radikal measures and re-adjusts the platter speed actively and Rega P10 PSU again equals (from a technical perspective) to sometwhat like Linn Valhalla, Herkules or Lingo PSU only. Consequently the LP12 is performing far higher than all other power supplies mentioned before. Effect is on Wow and flutter, PRAT, spatiality and details.
However, they are also following two fundamentally different design approaches. A Rega will always be perceived as a bit livelier and possibly also as more modern; a LP12 might be seen maybe to be more relaxed, more laid-back and yet with a lot of punch and a fabulous PRAT.
In what respect Dan? Dynamics, timing, bass response, resolution, treble? Do elucidate!
What’s gone wrong with this thread?
I thought we were going to see some handsome TTs?
Not seen any pictures in a while!
As you are with my Xerxes. Are you not with the Regas?
I sometimes think we can run out of pictures, unless we all go out and buy new gear.
Mind you given the huge amount of free publicity Rega gets on these pages I think they should be subbing Naim a tenner a picture.
I’ll go with that. They owe me £20 for the two pics of my P25!
Can you please advice whom to ask for those £20 expense allowance when it comes to Audio Linear, Lenco, Rek o Kut and others?