Unless you go directly to the known-good recipe of Netgear GS108Ev3 + iFi iPower X, I fear you may be underwhemed.
BUT, with those in between your router and EE8, the data present in this thread seems to suggest an improvement could be had. I am not making any guarantees though, having no experience using the EE8 in my own systems.
If you bought an EE8 new and similarly a new Cisco, the latter would not be cheap. You can compare your system with and without EE8; depending on which you prefer, determines your config. In the end enjoy the music, you can get caught with “what ifs”.
FWIW, I do have a switch, which is a necessity rather than a nice to have. Best advice as always, our ears don’t mislead us.
Thanks for observations, mine are a bit different regarding the topic. For me GS108 (standard) and iFi Power X are a mismatch really. Separately both a good products but not together. Then I consider iFi Elite to be a big step vs junior but only if used with relatively expensive (and matching because synergy is critical) power cable.
The GS105 & GS108 (standard not E versions) are relatively noisy themselves and can’t be set to work in low power mode which is where the most benefit is to be had from using a lower noise PSU.
If you already have an iFi Elite PSU then we would really recommend upgrading the switch to the GS108E: that is likely be a big improvement for a much lower cost than the Elite PSU was.
I have just bought GS105e. We’re a Mac household and I had no trouble in setting Low Power mode.
On the Netgear website you can find “NETGEAR Switch Discovery Tool for Mac” available for download. Running this on my MacBook, it found the IP address of the switch. Putting this into Safari opened the web configuration utility (using the default password given in the instructions that come with the switch). It’s then straightforward to switch on low power mode even for a network numpty like me!
Roger
Great. I have a GS105E on the way just need to find a good deal on a Elite PS.
I found the iFi Power X 12V does actually work really well.
@cb01 found that although the Elite was better than the Power X, it wasn’t as big a step forward over the Power X and the Power X was over the Power 2.
I’m happy with the Power X and am now going to experiment with Ethernet Isolators, as they have been suggested as giving a very significant improvement. I also found that adding an additional ferrite to the DC lead from the Power X altered the balance but wasn’t any real advantage.
As Xanthe has said, I recommend going with the iPower X. The Elite presents a much less value-dense proposition.
Hi Xanthe, back herding ferrites again, watch yer fingers, the little critters bite.
Do you know the switching frequency of your iFi unit ???
“Normal” SMPS switching frequency is typically from 50KHz to 1MHz, some go up to 3MHz, The ‘general purpose’ ferrites are around the 100MHz to 500MHz range, not very effective at SMPS switching frequencies.
The only mix that I know of that covers the SMPS range is Fair-Rite ‘75’, its impedance peak centred at 2MHz and therefore effective with SMPS applications.
I use it on my SMPS’s, a Friwo medi grade on the Cisco switch & the stock SMPS on the BT SH2 router.
Also a useful tweek with Ferrite is to pass the cable around the core a few times. This significantly multiplies up the impedance, e.g. the impedance of Fair-Rite 75 at 1MHz changes from 87ohms with a single pass to 790ohms with 3 turns and 2200ohms with 5 turns. Additionally multiple passes move the frequency range to lower MHz point and with the 75 mix it makes it more effective at the lowest SMPS switching frequency.
Hi Mike,
Yes very aware of that. We don’t know the switching frequency, but we suspect with the Power X that it’s likely to be fairly high to enable a greater reduction of the modulation of the output still using smaller electronic components.
The ferrites are Würth Elektronik ferrites, peak impedance is 200MHz, but they use a complex dopant that falls off much less rapidly, retaining good single pass impedance at 10Mhz. We were using 6 passes through the core.
The performance is linear with frequency 1Mhz to just below 100 MHz.
Well trained ferrites don’t bite unless you try clamping the larger ones onto your little fingers (or you get skin trapped when snapping them shut).
Update on using Ethernet isolators (Baaske Medical MI 1005 Network Isolator, which we got for £50 each - 2 off)
When an isolator is placed between the switch and the streamer, the sound from the streamer looses timing focus.
Hypothesis: as we’re already using reduced excitation voltage to the Ethernet cable (low power mode from the switch), the insertion loss of the isolator reduces the edge quality at the streamer, and either increases jitter, or possibly increases the number of resends.
However, when used between the NAS and the ‘audio’ switch and between the PoE switch for the WiFI mesh WAPs and the ‘audio’ switch, there is a very distinct improvement in temporal and amplitude resolution.
Definitely worth the £100 for the two isolators.
I am currently using one between my GS108 + iPower2 & the GS108Ev3 + iFi Elite. Mine is made by Baaske as well (MI-1005).
Funnily, my observations basically mirror yours.
The only two devices connected to the GS108Ev3 are my Roon Nucleus+ & the NDX2.
Network map (for this mesh node): Netgear Orbi RBK753 mesh point → Netgear GS108 + iFi iPower2 → Netgear GS108Ev3 + iFi Elite.
We don’t quite understand
The GS108E (+ iFi Elite) Connects to
→ NDX2
→ Roon Nucleus+
What you say above suggest it also connects via a MI1005 isolator
→ GS108 (+ iPower2) [via a MI1005 isolator]
That would be three devices!
.
That would be effectively the same as us:
The GS108E (+ iFi iPowerX) Connects to
272 (+ 555DR)
Synology NAS [via a MI1005 isolator]
TPLink LS105GP PoE [via a MI1005 isolator]
The PoE switch connect to the WAPs (using PoE) and the rest of our network
Yes, I use the two switches in-series as they service the Roon Nucleus & NDX2 vs the other devices on that node that connect directly to the GS108 dumb switch (Apple TV, LG Smart TV, etc).
I have found that using the two switches in series sounds better than simply connecting everything to the GS108Ev3. The thrust of my prior comment was that the insertion of an MI-1005 isolator between the two switches brought improvements that were the same as what you described…though your setup differs somewhat from what I understand.
The only difference is that I use two isolators:
One between the two switches (same as your arrangement).
The other between the NAS drive and the GS105E switch.
I use a few as well, that I have omitted for brevity. A Stack Audio SmoothLAN for the NDX2 and an EMO Labs EN-85e + a pair of DX Engineering ISO-Plus isolators for the the Roon Nucleus. Each brought an additive improvement, in a very similar manner as we have both cited above.
I like value so I’ll keep an eye out for a deal on a X power supply. Thanks for the advice.
How does one enable power saving mode on the GS105E? Thanks!
In addition to watever power saving the Netgear GS105’E’ has, some/most/all switches have some form of auto power saving.
Energy Efficient Ethernet (IEEE 802.3az) standard includes
– Auto Power-Down / Sleep mode.
This turns off power to port(s) if nothing connected or the connected device is powered off.
– Adjusts Power Based on Cable Length.
This detects length of connected cable and adjusts power usage accordingly. However I believe the minimum detected length is typical of most all domestic installations (i.e. it will always be on the lowest (shortest) setting.
See above, post 43.
Roger