The classical music thread

As always with his core repertoire, Karajan recorded the Brahms Symphonies many times over. His ‘best’ is a matter for debate, but I think that his first Berlin complete set, made in the 1960s after he took over the Berlin Philharmonic, is the one to go for. DGG rereleased that set on LP quite recently. I’m not sure about their availability on CD.

Moving away from Karajan, two older sets of the Brahms symphonies on EMI might be of interest to you, Adrian Boult conducting the London Symphony Orchestra and London Philharmonic, and Otto Klemperer conducting the Philharmonia (maybe New Philharmonia?).

I like very much Eugen Jochum’s set on DGG, early stereo recordings with the Berlin Philharmonic of Furtwængler’s time.

One of Furtwængler’s successors, Claudio Abbado’s Berlin Philharmonic recordings are great performances, and very well recorded (again DGG).

Carlos Kleiber’s Vienna Philharmonic recording of Brahms’ Fourth belongs in any serious record collection, one of DGG’s very first digital recordings, still available on LP and CD. You say that you are looking for a recording of Brahms’ Fourth ‘to love’, and this would be my recommendation for that - superlative playing from the Vienna Philharmonic for Kleiber. He was a truly brilliant conductor, so much better than anyone else!

Brahms Symphonies have been ‘lucky’ on record. There are so many more that are worth hearing, Fritz Reiner in Chicago, George Szell in Cleveland are well worth seeking out. Guido Cantelli, Toscanini’s chosen successor, made some great Brahms recordings before his tragic early death in an aeroplane crash.

I hope that (some of) these will be of interest.

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I searched for that first cycle as a set on CD from time to time. Never saw one. However, Presto has it available as a download (with a hi-res option). I picked that up. But it may not appeal to Josquin.

I’m surprised. If we’re talking about the same set (and I think we are), I bought two new LP sets at the start of the year (or maybe towards the very end of last year). I think that the seller was probably Amazon in Germany (as I prefer to buy LPs in their country of manufacture). I’ll have a look, and post if I find anything.

For the Brahms symphonies, look to Dohnanyi with the Cleveland Orchestra (better than Szell) …

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There are more Karajan LP and CD recordings of Brahms symphonies on AmazonDOTde than you could shake a stick at - including my personal favourite, his first complete Berlin set on DGG.

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I have this version of Brahms / BPO / Jochum, which is all mono. I also have a stereo set with Karajan, which is played more frequently.

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Just ordered a copy of the Karajan😁

That’s the Jochum set which I had in mind when I mentioned him above, but I misremembered some of it as being recorded in stereo - my apologies if that was wrong!

It’s great music, and very well performed on those CDs. I must dig them out when I get home and listen to his accounts again soon. Brahms’s symphonies are each very different, but all are very great music.

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I do have Karajan’s 60s cycle, both as an original numbered DGG box (SKL 133/139) bundled with the Violin Concerto, Haydn Variations and German Requiem; as well as the more recent DG Classics reissue from a few years ago. I also have Szell/Cleveland of #1 and Haitink/Concertgebouw of #4.

That’s what I have on vinyl. I have some others on digital, including Janoski/Pitsburgh and Fischer/Budapest. Then there is whatever I can find on Qobuz.

I will seek out some other recommendations. I still prefer vinyl. I don’t buy CDs anymore. I don’t have a player anyway, and what i used to rip CDs isn’t setup anymore.

If you’re looking for a recommendation for a Brahms symphony, go for Carlos Kleiber’s Vienna PO recording of the Fourth, one of DGG’s very first digital recordings. It’s available from Amazon.de on LP or CD - or on CD only, if you prefer to buy from Amazon in the UK.

Sorry, I’m like a broken record in recommending Carlos Kleiber’s recordings, but he was easily the greatest conductor in the last few decades of the last century - he just didn’t like recording, sadly.

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Do you have a link?

It is a numbered limited edition from several years ago. All the usual places had it but I believe it is OOP/OOS at this point. Acoustic Sounds still shows it as backordered but that only means the distributor hasn’t cancelled their order for it. I don’t see it waiting for a repress. It was limited to 2000 copies worldwide when it came out.

Thanks. I must have missed it. I only checked from time to time.

The only other CD set of the 60s cycle I could find appeared to be on the Urania label - unless Amazon has mis-identified it. I do know that Presto did not have the cycle on CD.

I’ll stay with Klemperer, Walter and Mackerras. Although I love most of Szell’s recordings, I am not thrilled with his Brahms symphonies.

I don’t think I was clear, but I am referring to the vinyl version of that DG Classics reissues of the Brahams/Karajan 60s cycle. What I said may or may not apply to a CD version, if it was released in that form. CDs are just never a consideration for me.

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I’m now listening to my OG copy of the Karajan/Brahms 60s DGG cycle I mentioned earlier. I’m surprised by how well it sounds for its age. So often those old DGG tulips copies are really noisy.

Every time I look at that cover photo I can’t help but think he looks really creepy…like keep him away from my wife creepy. :rofl:

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I think that you’re being a little bit unfair. He’s trying to suppress his inner smugness at being in charge of what was then unarguably the world’s greatest orchestra (which is pretty remarkable, given the state that Germany had been in just twenty years earlier).

Do remember that Herbie was a bit of a short arse, so he’s trying to look masterful and get over his ‘Napoleon complex’.

All that said, this is a very masterful (that word again!) set of the Brahms Symphonies - I don’t know of any better. I have a new, unplayed set waiting for me at home.

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My box also has a nice performance of the Violin Concerto, with Christian Ferras, plus the Deutsche Requiem with the Wiener Singverein. I am playing the Violin Concerto now.

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Christian Ferras was for many years (1960s) Karajan’s violinist of choice. They made a number of concerto recordings together, before Karajan hit on the practice of using his orchestra’s leader as soloist. He probably felt more in control that way.

Karajan carried on the practice when Michel Schwalbė took over as leader in Berlin.

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Pollini continues to record and with this album completes his second run of Beethoven’s last sonatas. He’s still a formidable Beethoven pianist, even as these performances are nowhere near as clean or secure as his earlier recordings. But like the recent recording by Anne Queffélec, the experience and vision shine through the simetimes distressed fingerwork, and it’s again an engrossing experience.

Cheers
EJ

I’m very surprised to read you saying that Pollini has now recorded all the Beethoven Sonatas for a second time. If that’s the case, I wonder if we might be lucky enough to get the complete cycle on LPs.

I was lucky enough to see Pollini a number of times at the Royal Festival Hall (and maybe once in the Barbican Centre), usually with his good friend Claudio Abbado conducting the London Symphony Orchestra when he was its principal conductor.

[Pollini was one of the few instrumentalists that Carlos Kleiber admired, and they had plans to record the Beethoven Piano Concertos together in Vienna with the Philharmonic for DGG. They even all got into a recording studio, but one of the musicians made the mistake (in a preparatory run through) of querying a tempo with Pollini, rather than with Kleiber. Kleiber took offence and, before anyone knew what was happening, Kleiber was in his big Audi heading back home to Munich. What a fr*gging shame!]

I also saw Emil Gilels just the once (on the night that the SAS were storming the Iranian Embassy a few miles away). Very sadly indeed, Gilels died shortly before he was able to complete his magisterial recordings of the Beethoven Piano Sonatas - he didn’t record the first or the last of them, with three more not making it onto tape. Fortunately, DGG issued the 27 that he did record in a box. It is one of my most beloved sets.

Gilels and Pollini were both extraordinary musicians, and I wouldn’t dare try to separate them. Gilels was a squat leonine figure with a shock of red hair, who strutted onto the stage and just got on with things. Pollini cast a more casual image - he is (or was) a chain smoker, so was probably gasping for a fag.

Wonderful memories, which I treasure.