100% as it is in my system … very sad…
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We need to join arms in solidarity guys. Our systems mean alot to us and when things are off balance it affects our emotional well being.
So I am here for you guys! We will come through this. I know it’s tough. I know you look at your systems and think when will it be right? When are Naim going to sort things out? Why haven’t Naim answered on this forum? I know!
But, I believe they are on it! Be patient and try to focus on other things until this is sorted out.
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Me too🙂
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Well after 30 plus years sticking with Naim for a few more week’s then what the hell 
I love the brand. Naim amps deliver a sound I love that no other brands can touch.
Tonight the setup sounds awesome 
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That’s gonna make it tricky to leave the brand altogether!
Great to hear that your system is firing on all cylinders at the moment.
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That’s the spirit! Naim are on the case and I’m sure there will be a resolution, hopefully not too far away.
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Over the years I’ve invested so much into the brand along with others, I reckon the pending firmware will deliver with a punch!
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As HH that’s the spirit. Positive mindset. At times I find a problem with everything! When sound system isn’t right it can feel like the end of the world!
And then I have to say life is pretty good, and try not to complain too much!
A bit of patience and goodwill to Naim engineers who will be on this!
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I hope so Dan! Tonight though the main setup sounds sublime and I will take this especially on a Friday evening as I like to unwind. The girls are using the second setup ND5XS2 / N50 with their friends tonight so I’m unable to give this a thorough listen but no complaints yet.
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I keep switching on and off Spotify. I wonder if the apparent improvement is a dithering effect. If it helps, it doesn’t matter, though it seems to add the same ‘sound’ to all tracks. It improves the apparent detail, but also adds noise which makes me think it is doing something similar to using dither to deal with quantization error.
I agree that Naim will get this all sorted. Patience is in order.
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I’ve realised that one of the things that bothers me most with recordings is the timing being right. Since I got the ndac the timing was perfect and it’s still fine on airplay but via other sources it’s too fast I just listened to Mariah Carey all I want for Christmas first from my server directly from the naim app then the exact same file via airplay using the vlc app. Whilst the former sounded impressive in a lot of ways all I could picture was everyone involved collapsing in exhaustion because it’s like someone has put it on slightly increased speed 
. Just an observation I found interesting about how I perceive sound.
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Its a bit early for Christmas songs 
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Sacrilege it’s practically December at this point, I started November 1st . August through Halloween is early as far as I’m concerned. I don’t listen to them the rest of the year so November through to Christmas Day I mostly listen to Christmas stuff.
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Have a listen to the ‘Christmas with my friends’ series. They are on ACT, led by Nils Landgren. The earlier albums are best, but they are all lovely. No Christmas stuff here until 1 December.
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I will look it up thanks for the rec.
What do you mean by timing? Clock rate or analogue phase?
The nDAC will match and lock its clock to the source clocking, or use an adaptive clock if it can’t. If the clock is locked the sync light is lit, if the adaptive clock is active the light will extinguish from memory… I’d be surprised if you would notice a change in pitch though.
Hi @Simon-in-Suffolk , you reacted to an earlier reaction by me regarding the timing seeming to be off as if the clock wasn’t syncing right. You said it was highly unlikely. You have way more knowledge about these things. I tried getting an answer from Chat GPT. Here is the link, at first in Dutch and then in English. Maybe you could help me and others explaining how this works with Naim streamers.
Because as said earlier as well, I am not a technician and have no clue how these things could influence SQ or not. Thanks in advance!
I have to admit that I seem to be sensitive to the ‘timing’ thing - although I don’t think it has anything to do with clock timing, more a perception of timing. I can only guess at what causes the differences but I think it may have something to do with the ‘space’ created between notes.
As I’ve reduced ‘noise’ within the system this ‘space’ between notes seems to have got better, which in turn prepares you for the next note, almost like better musical anticipation - if that makes any sense? I find this gives me a much better ‘emotional’ connection to the music, which in turn makes me tap my foot more.
I remember vividly the first time I heard a familiar piece of music on a friends Statement system. I commented how much longer the track seemed and how well it was timed. Of course in reality the time the track took to play would be the same on any system but it’s the perception of the timing that’s important.
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Guys what timing are we referring to? If it’s the clock timing and how Naim devices establish and lock onto the sample rate timing to match the incoming data rate, Naim describe this in their white papers, here is the ND555 with a discussion how it was done on the NDAC and differences on the ND555 (and ND streamers ) -
Page 5
Phase timing is mostly in the analogue domain and that is mostly handled by the speakers and room, and to some extent the electronics. There are some aspects in the digital domain when using type of anti aliasing filter, or reconstruction filter affect phase. Appendix 2 of the above doc.
Analogue phase accuracy is about frequency elements being in their correct space in time … where they are overly displaced or delayed one starts to lose detail. A reflection in a room, or the equivalent in a speaker cabinet or a signal reflection in an electronic device can displace frequencies, ie adjust the timing of those frequencies, resulting in loss of detail and micro transients.
There is then musical timing … which is as the many of us who play instruments or sing is all about the rhythmic and repetitive aspect of playing rhythm and motifs which we adjust expressively either in combination or in solo.
Now this timing is captured in a recording or production, however in replay it can be filtered with the above considerations, or sometimes exaggerated in the replay chain. Some of these exaggeration effects are applied in the mix and production stage too, and I have described some of those elsewhere on the forum.
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@Simon-in-Suffolk I will just try to put in words my own experience when listening to the new firmware. That’s the only thing I experience first hand, and therefore the only thing that I can state as truthfull.
When listening to music after the update, I experience from time to time a fatiguing sound from my set up. The music sounds messy to my ears at moments, and higher frequency tones sometimes make me twinge. This experience can change during the same listening session.
The messiness for me is best described as if the timing isn’t right. Especially because one moment a specific piece of music can sound beautiful and another moment totally wrong. That’s where my thoughts are coming from and why I started guessing something might be wrong in the syncing of the frequencies. You then said in reply that in your opinion a firmware update should not alter the working of the clocks, or at least highly unlikely.
Before the update however I did not experience these fluctuations. And it feels strange as I have tried to analyze also how I feel during the sessions. For example, am I tired whilst listening and if so, is it physically tired or mentally. And if I’m not tired, do I still experience the same? And the amswer is yes.
And when reading the info from Chat GPT, I drew the conclusion that the firmware update could have affected the clocks.
From what I understand is that you say that the way Naim devices have the clocks managed, it should not have been affected by the firmware update. Correct?
Hopefully it makes sence, English isn’t my native language.
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