Unhappy with the new NAIM update

Thanks Rob, you’re a great man! I have made good friends on here. And that is so important!

We will get there one way or another!

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I’ve lost track, is there an issue?

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No Mike. Just preparing to go active SL2’s with S1’s :flushed:

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Well I finally got the Burndy undone and removed one of my 555PS (the Analogue supply) ready to take to my Dealer tomorrow for a swap and check if it is damaged.
I tried the system with one PS on the ND555 - and the problem I figured was a broken PS is still there!
Either I have something else damaged in the system - Pre onwards, or it it actually sounds like this?

It is even brighter with one PS - have others found this?
It is a brighter less-interesting version of the music compared to two PS used on the ND555.
I may try the supply back again in a bit as it actually resolves a lot more info and does not blur the bright effect out, so to speak, but reolves it into crisp edges on instruments and unfortunately parts of vocals - but for all that is easier on the ear.

The analogue PS part of the 555PS has virtually no use for ten or more years so may need to warm-up - I think I do hear some correct darkening very gradually creeping-in so it may settle.

I’ll explore a bit more. I was hoping putting it onto one good PS (assuming there is actially anything wrong with the other) would calm things down but as of yet I am not getting this.

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Hope its not the S1….:crossed_fingers:t4:

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I’ve put the second PS back and it sounds better even though the edginess and ocasional ‘spits’ are back. I’ve no idea what is going on or if I have a problem and were - or if this is actually what it now sounds like?

Others have commented on bright and glassy - yes that can be there.
I’ve been playing with the G5 mains block and I’ve had times when it seemed a lot better to the extent I was almost begiining to think it may settle and be ‘ok but a bit bright’ but otherwise liveable - so I will see if I can get back to that. Perhaps that happens after it has been powered-on for a while.

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Yes there is a way to.
What will you do about it?
Wait or change?

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This is what most in this thread prefer :heart_eyes:

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In my test setup it was brighter with 2xps. But this was with 3.8. fw

Hope that the s1 is ok.
Is it sounding worth than with 3.10.0?
Maybe it is the FW effect even more pronounced with s1 - but if so, cohen must have heared it in a second.
Keep us posted!
But - maybe it is the glassy sound which is ruining my joy the last days.

The ‘brightness’ with two PS is more concentrated into edges whereas with one PS I was getting more of a general sheen I did not like.

On some music and particular track compositions it works better than on others…for now I’ll leav it in there and continue my other investigations into the Mains block which has had a larger impact than I thought.
Also my system tuning for 3.8 FW may not have been optimum for this 3.10.1 - I could not use 3.10.0 much at all as it was all over the place.

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Sounds like the same issue as I still have - some songs are bad. Glassy with instruments like strings/guitar and voices is what describes it best.
The tuning (re-plugging) might tame a bit, but healing?
I have not heared 3.10.0 much, therefore I can not tell, if 10.1 is much better. Bass seems much better - but HF not.

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Yes - bass is far better than I’ve had.
Top-end has leading-edge detail but poor micro-detail or harmonic structure rendering.
Perhaps most people do not hear that aspect as much but the older FW had a very immersive presentation.

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Spot on! 100% agree. I have listened so much last 2 years to updates and compared - my ears are „calibrated“ for recognizing the differences.
And with 552/500 is was a good bit more pronounced.

How can I tell (without writing bad English here)…
What I also miss is that tones had some „micro aura“ with fine details. With new fw the sound starts/stops much faster (harder transient/edges), wich make it punchy in a hifi way, but less involving.
With acoustic guitars it is most prominent - with 3.8 there was more body and the guitar-strings had swung longer (it is called reverberant sound?). I miss this very much.
In some recordings guitars now sounds like a harp.

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If 90% of Naim streamer owners prefer the latest update then my hands will be tied.

I believe Naim should also consider those who have not made the updates and still running 3.8, as myself.

I have no intention of updating until this has been resolved, if not, when the time comes I will move on.
As I am sure you will too, along with other respected members.

:thinking: Does that become a musical or business decision for Naim ?

All power to your elbow as they say, you may represent more people than you know.

Festive wishes and a Happy Year

Russ (Also a lifelong Cohen fan)

Full 500 system

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Great post Rusty. Thank you

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Yes. Remember @Richard.Dane stating that all customers are valued by Naim, happy or not. Naim wants to help.

And afaik Naim also said (maybe not directly here in the forum) that if after this update there still would be question marks on the topic of aound quality that they would dive into that.

So I guess they will be very willing to listen to the stories you will tell from your own experience and those of others.

I agree, less body and meat on the bones with the latest firmware. This is on a 333/300. The difference was stark and this is not from distant audio memory, I skipped a version and upgraded from two versions ago to the latest one. Immediate increase in treble resolution, which feels artificial, and loss of body. Loss of holographic/3d properties. This is from as close as I could get to A/Bing my streamer with the old and new FWs, as I updated after playing my reference playlist on 5.8.1 and immediately played again on 5.10.1. I am certain that anyone would immediately pick up on the stark differences if there was an opportunity to A/B the releases. And I can see how, depending on the rest of the system, some people may prefer the additional air in this new release. But for me the Naim magic is gone.

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whats the [ got to do with this?

Martin

Please count me in. I would definitely go back to 3.8.x.

I will be writing to Naim in the New Year. They have to be very careful this is not their ‘Ratner’ moment.

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This is true, certainly on my 500 series system. AND yesterday I went from 3.8.x to 3.10.1 in my second system and the sound signature was so different. Including on a few tracks shrill in the vocal domain when they sing, in this instance, Chris Martin (my son’s offering) on tidal max. Shiver from Parachutes. As an example.

This is not to say it’s all bad. It’s not.

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