Upgrade router and its power supply?

Yes indeed David was helpful and it was good of him to warn me in advance that BT routers have unusual DC input requirements in terms of the cable. Between them I find that Futureshop and MCRU are pretty darn good when it comes to sourcing things like LPSUs and cables

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I very much doubt itā€¦ quality xDSL modem routers are more sensitive than many Hi-Fi components when it comes to emissions and RFI, as xDSL routers are very sensitive to RFI and electrical noise ā€¦ as that will affect and diminish the sync speed, add data errors, and basically customers would be getting a sub standard service.
So I think you can be assure on a device like a SH2 that any radiated noise will be of a low level. But do ensure you keep your broadband router away from any sources of noise like a flat screen TV etc.
Do keep your line side data link (or possibly phone line) away from your audio wiring.I find using a commercial grade twisted pair link to the master socket from the router has helped with a slightly improved noise margin.

The SH2 itself is quite an advanced deviceā€¦ I was quite impressed with what it does under the coversā€¦ and even has a certain feature that helps Naim device discovery.

I have a iFi Power 2 winging itā€™s here to power my TP-Link AC2100 router. Not sure why iā€™ve ordered it to be honest as the stock one seems fine enough. I reckon i might be suffering with boredomā€¦ :wink:

Do check the power supply has the right capacitance (HF) decoupling for your router, or your new LPS may be creating more DC side noise and could mar performance or put your router outside its noise emissions standards. You will probably be ok, but these things are not always plug and play if the product says to use the supplied power supply. You may need to contact TP to see if the DC powersupplies are inter changeable.

An after market LPS doesnā€™t always mean lower noise and can actually increase it.

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Well upgrading mine lowered the noise floor. I just checked volt and amp compatibility. I must have just ā€œdropped luckyā€ :roll_eyes:.

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My stock TP- Link router PSU is a 12v - 1.5 amp. Iā€™m assuming a iFi Power2 12v - 1.8 amp version will be compatible?

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Stephen it should be fine. Just watch out that some routers (e.g. BT) have unusual DC tip sizes so not all replacement power supplies will come with the correct tip amongst the selection they typically come with. The biggest gains do come from linear power supplies in my experience but do report your findings back here.

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My Sky Q router is exactly the same spec and the ifi works fine with it . The ifi comes with six or so different size connectors so Iā€™m sure that one of them will fit your devicešŸ‘

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Ok thanks guys :+1:

Which noise floor? The ground plane noise floor of your router? How did you measure it - what spectrum analyser are you using or you using something else? They are smart bits of kit.

Simon

LOL - the connectors donā€™t define the decoupling. Unless a device is designed to use aftermarket power supplies do check when you swap it outā€¦ with an aftermarket oneā€¦ especially if its device with high speed digital electronics. It might also define the size of the common mode choke on the DC lead so the device when powered is compliant to its EM specs

A little knowledge etcā€¦ you might know how to measure the radiated emissions and noise levels of ground planes - but its probably fair to say that most on this forum donā€™t.

:joy:

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Simon I think youā€™re being a tad facetious here as Iā€™m sure you know he must be talking about the perceived noise floor when he is streaming, so it is the noise floor of the streaming setup

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Spot on friend but let him have his moment! :roll_eyes:

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But that is a nonsense - its another example of audiophile techno babble - string words and terms together to try and justify something. We have seen it over the years - itā€™s not new.

There are some that read this forum for advice - and its a free for anyone to share their experiences - but trying to justify it on ā€˜lowering noise floorā€™ without explaining what you are actually measuring is factually misleadingā€¦

If you do something because you prefer the way it makes your system sound - then SAY THAT - donā€™t try and justify it technically unless you are prepared to say why in a meaningful way.

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Ok It sounds like a lower noise floor Einstein! :joy:

Thatā€™s why I said ā€œperceivedā€. None of us who are adding audio grade switches or doing what this thread talks about, upgrading router power supplies, claim we have done measurements. So by default we are talking subjective impressions and we kind of shouldnā€™t have to point that out, it should be pretty darn obvious to be honest. I really donā€™t want this thread to become yet another measurement vs subjective view debate as that has been hashed out so many times before

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indeed - just also remember with EM issues - you can cause side effects elsewhere that is nothing to do with audio - hence my point about checking a LPS is suitable for connection to a specific device that comes with its specific power supply - and likely has been tested and accredited with it.

LPS can cause issues with harmonic distortion on the mains - unless likely very inefficient or very small - so with all power supplies whether linear or switched use the appropriate quality power supply suitable for the connected device.

And being an engineer - you can always measure what you hear (as distinct from determining whether a set of sounds is aesthetically interesting) - and beyond what you can hearā€¦ if you are unable to measure what you hear - the chances are you are not measuring the right thing. There is no mystique.

Even the UPNP server sound differences with the first gen streamers that some perceived - on investigation I could in the end measure. The factor in the end was not particularly obvious. The world of physics and its interactions goes way beyond the simplified basic tutorials that many get a base understanding of concepts from.

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Simon Iā€™m sure this is good advice. With routers it is quite hard to find a lot of audiophiles talking about using linear power supplies on forums etc to judge how well they work and if they cause problems, which is partly why I created this thread in the first place. Whereas with DACs etc it is easier to see from forum discussions - I mean look at the 100s of threads all over audio groups about power supplies for the Qutest for example. I take your point completely about being careful, itā€™s well made.

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Sure - but its probably because routers donā€™t really feature - possibly their switch ports might - if you like the sounds from different switches etc. However I do recommend that home network equipment is kept physically away from sensitive audio equipment and leads.

I suspect it is as likely interactions from a hair dryer or tumble dryer causing a degree of asymmetric loading on the mains - but in the limit there is a level where you cease to obsess about and subtle changes donā€™t become meaningful.
Audio replay is such a relatively compromised chain I feel there is little to add in finessing here. The AES had an interesting article from somebody on this - where they were defining true hidef as indistinguishable from real life - and then examined how massively apart we are from being able to achieve this with current and foreseeable recording, production and replay technologies.

Having said all that - despite the very compromised chains - a system that gets you closer to that recording is very satisfying.