Interesting, I find Pmc (especially the stand mounts) too hot in the treble and eventually crave something smoother, my little scm11’s are as detailed as 25.21 but less explicit.
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Another fair observation.
I remember when Twenty5 was upgraded to “ i “ specification and there was a lot of debate about them being too energetic / bright.
Think the PMC’s do lean that way.
Personally, don’t think it’s an issue.
Once you move to active, the overall presentation changes again. Would say that same characteristic disappears, ( or at least less apparent), amongst all the other things that become present, with active. Somehow appears more balanced.
R
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Since their beginnings I’ve been aware of PMC as a transmission line manufacturer, with all the benefits that beings at the bottom end, focusing initially at pro level (monitor speakers for recording studios) And my awareness of ATC was initially as as a high quality loudspeaker driver manufacturer, focussed initially at that same pro level, expanding first to full speaker systems for that same pro monitor market as PMC. PMC moved earlier into domestic hifi, initially with larger speakers, but gradually developing smaller for the more mass market. ATC did much the same, first with poorly disguised domestic versions of pro monitors, then getting more into the aesthetics and adding small speakers. Both specialise in producing low distortion neutral speakers, the biggest difference on balance (as opposed to between specific models) being PMC’s greater bass extension to the TL designs, but with a trade off of cost, TL being more expensive to design and build, so at any given price it might be expected that ATC would be better at mid/top and PMC at the bottom end, while when cost is no object PMC might be best overall.
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Enjoyed reading that…
Thought that was a fair synopsis ( contrasting sonic style between brands) from what I’ve heard in recent weeks. But also thoughtful explanation of how they both arrive at differences. Learned something.
Thanks for that 
R
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They have certainly both been around for a long time. Both are very good speaker manufacturers, both have strengths and design styles, PMC transmission lines and ATC actives. I’ve always viewed PMC as being more market focussed, I don’t see this so much with ATC.
Personally, in the context of this thread, if choosing actives I would go with ATC , with passives PMC, although this is a far more competitive market.
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Looking at this commercially is actually a fascinating perspective.
Some thoughts to share…
In the modern world, there might be several key considerations for a commercially successful consumer audio speaker product.
Current consumer trends are towards fewer “separate” boxes, but without compromise to audio quality. As an example, consider the new Naim 200 and 300 product ranges. Within this consumer environment, active speakers ( with active cross over, amp packs, etc, held internally, within a speaker cabinet), may be more desirable, than previously.
ATC have led the UK consumer market for some years. They seem well established in this market segment.
In PMC’s case, they have created an upgrade module, which can be applied to all Twenty series speaker products going back some 8 or 9 years. Creating a potential market for 1000’s of existing and legacy product owners. As well as new sales, as active speakers, going forward into the future.
Also, at their respective price points, the PMC Twenty5 active options mostly sit under the ATC prices. Providing a route into active not maybe previously available.
More consumer interest in active generally, will also benefit ATC, as consumers search for alternative offers and at different price points.
For purchase decisions, mostly product performance and price will be a key attribute. Other factors affecting decision making being : ease of use ; system integration and connectivity; design and aesthetics ; colour and finish options ; access to post sales support ; resale values, etc, etc.
With PMC, the difference in price between passive and active versions of their Twenty5 products is about £1,500. The upgrade modules bought separately are £1,795 by themselves, for a retrofit. Which has been made simple enough for dealers or end users to install.
For ATC same difference - for example with SCM19 is £2,400 and their SCM40 model is £3,500. For their “entry” range products, no such retrofit is currently available. To move from passive to active requires purchasing a new speaker. So, no retrofit.
MRRP’s are current at time of writing, June 2024.
So, consider this - entry into main consumer active speaker market - to be a really shrewd commercial venture for the PMC business.
BW
R
p.s. @glasnaim so sorry for slower post, just completed.
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Commercially it depends on what you are looking for, active or passive. If active the ATC19A are a good choice both in terms of price and track record. The PMC Twenty5 active are more expensive by approximately £1000 but ATC have 10% price rise due July. Whilst the active PMCs are new they have a very nice design that would fit in anywhere.
Sticking with these brands if you raise your budget your active choice would likely be ATC but alternatively passively you have lots of choice available in combining some great amps with very good PMC speakers.
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I completely disagree. My previous speakers were indeed PMCs, which I had for several years, and quite enjoyed. But for me the ATC actives were hugely preferable and I can listen to them for hours and never experience listening fatigue. It’s absolutely nothing to do with impressing people, simply that they give me far more lasting musical pleasure than any speakers I’ve had before including my old PMCs.
Roger
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Hi @PeakMan
You are absolutely right to fundamentally disagree with me. However, just trying to point out to the perspective purchaser that there are two sides to the page and one size does not fit all. 
Speakers are very much a matter of taste, of course aesthetically but also, and fundamentally, acoustically, as they affect the sound character of a system more than any other component. Quite simply where one person prefers the house sound character and or styling of one brand, another will prefer the other - I don’t think it is possible to generalise on who will prefer what!.
In my case I prefer full range ‘monitor’ type speakers, as in PMCs above the TwentyX range, and, though I haven’t heard any, I suspect only ATCs from 100 upwards would stand a chance of grabbing me, but whether they would I cannot know without trying - given my long standing preference for TL bass it is uncertain (this considering without use of a sub.) - but nothing whatsoever to do with image of either brand.
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@ratrat Have you got a chance to compare the 25.23i driven by either 250DR or 300DR against their active version? I’m interested to know if the actives sound colder or more digital than when driven passively. Also, which one sounds more energetic and powerful, the actives or the 300Dr driven passives?
Thank you mate.
Hi @Dan.S
Hope you’re having fun with your recent new boxes.
Take a look back a few posts, to the most recent update…
Yes. Compared the PMC 23i, as active, with passive version and addition of a better Naim power amplifier.
The Naim NC250 power amplifier was used and indicated general direction of passive option with “ better power amp” compared to active. See above for thoughts.
The 300 ( or even NC250 or OC 250 DR ) is a fine amplifier, with bags of power on tap, refinement, grip and control. Active offers something slightly different, in addition to similar grip and control.
For OC 250 or 300, others might have experience of your specific use case. If you go back, a few users have discussed doing their own due diligence and going active. IIRC, at least two 300 users, went over to ATC active.
Hope that helps
Good luck
R
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How could that be (whatever more digital actually means sound-wise!)?
Nothing really to add other than I’m sat listening to some active PMC 23s at Moorgate Acoustics whilst I wait to drop off my 42/110 for servicing. And they sound very nice indeed. Sounds like you’re enjoying the journey @ratrat - really interested what you decide on 8)
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Love that place …
HiFi to look at and listen.
Uncle Darran at Class A Audio upstairs to sort anything technical
Records down stairs, in the basement, to browse and buy.
What’s not to like ?
Hope you’re having a fun time around Moorgate this morning.
Enjoy
R
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This thread has certainly sparked some interesting comments but all good reading apart from the comment on a fourth coming price rise of 10% in July regarding ATC speakers, that’s not good news.
Just to add from my impressions of active sound signatures I have found the sound to be very accurate with a tight grip, which I would imagine comes from the better control of the drive units by the use of a more accurate cross over and matching power amp sections.
I have heard the ATC 50a several times and really enjoyed what they do but sadly out of my price range plus don’t imagine the wife would be over impressed with their size.
I think which ever brand you choose be it ATC or PMC member generally would not be disappointed, looking forward to more posts on this topic.
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Not so much accuracy of XO nor matching of amp, rather through having no componentry between amp and voice coil, also “damping factor” is maximised.
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So with the amplifier feeding directly to the voice coils accounts for the way an active speakers sound signature differs from its passive version?
It accounts for the tight grip and control, but won’t change general sound character of the speaker. If the overall sound character changes it most likely will be the different amp. Active one from either ATC or PMC probably the more neutral.
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Morning ratrat hope the auditioning is going well, I have a question you maybe able to help with, I noticed in a couple of your photos a coil of cable guessing they were there ready to hook up the active speakers, length of cable for the active hook up, l’m sure I had read on a few occasions here on the forum that you have to be mindful of the length of cable used as it can cause issues with Naim preamps, was this mentioned at all when you were talking to your dealer? Cheers.
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