I think ex demo is good idea. When I bought my d3’s from my local dealer they were 5 years old but in pristine condition. I’m don’t think they had been played much as he sold about two pairs a year so they mainly stood idle. They actually improved over the next few months with constant playing.
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Thanks - I appreciate it! One has to be a little concerned about the diamond tweeter, which can be fragile. I don’t know how much abuse demo models get and whether there could be other points of failure to be concerned about. Still, if there’s a full warranty, that adds some reassurance.
To use an artistic analogy, the Serafinos are a bit like an Impressionist painting - a Monet poppy field perhaps - beautifully sunlit with gorgeous colours and textures - but lacking the hard edges and contrasts of a fine Old Master painting.
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You raise, to me, a number of valid buying decisions.
In my case I had to move on the unmarked and packing parts on the 802 D3s. I was not willing to go through a private sale with all the home visits involved. Perhaps I should have bought at launch.
When is the right time to buy? A very personal decision.
I am a bit of a fuss pot and want a new pristine product which you will get from an authorised dealer.
Plus packing up the old and installing the new is a good half day plus and best left to them. A two person job .The last thing you want is even a tiny scratch. Having said that I did buy my dealers ex demo, pre DR 500 years ago.
At this level you have to balance cost versus satisfaction and try to dismiss within reason what you are spending. The bonus is a top of the range product.
Last night I played the Ravel Daphnis et Chloe on the Chandos label from my CD555. I’ll say no more than: WOW.
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Alright if you have limitless funds, but to me ex dem or secondhand makes the difference between a lesser model and a better model. When I heard the 802D2 ex dem but was being offered at £12k with a list price of £18k. MB2SE similar prices. I didn’t notice any cosmetic damage to either, but even if there was, being able to buy one instead of a model or two lower in the range would make minor cosmetic imperfections irrelevant (and major would lower the price significantly). I don’t know about B&W’s unpacking, but other than weight there is nothing difficult with the PMC, and when, later, I got a pair of MB2s (at a lot lower price), I had no real difficulty unpacking on my own, though getting onto their stands wasn’t so easy and perhaps I should have waited until a son was home.
BTW, the 802 is not a top of the range product - there is the 801 above it, so for the price of 802 new you could possibly have indeed got the too of the range if you had bought secondhand or ex-dem! (And new or used makes no difference to where it is in the range.)
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…and the 801 d4 Signature on top of that 
If I had the money and the room size I would ne a contender for the 801 Signature. The late
Derek Jenkins, the LP12, Guru summed up the whole hi-fi scene in the words “there is always more”.
The D5 range when it appears would be likely to incorporate the Signature mods?
I would have thought so - and having heard the 801 d4 Signature, this would be very compelling.
I did hear a rumour that there were major upgrades taking place at the factory, so I wonder if we might see some changes to the body shape as well?
Perhaps another reason not to pay full price for a d4 right now.
Another question to B&W 802-series owners on this forum @RWC, @Douglas , etc.
- Boomy Bass. Did you notice this at first - and if so, does it go away?
I’m sure one could move the speakers to reduce this, but the bass I’m getting from the 803s isn’t as tightly controlled as that from the Serafinos. I’m wondering if, as the drivers/surrounds loosen up a bit, whether the bass becomes more manageable? I don’t want to have the speakers in the middle of the room!
My speakers should be at least 50cm from the rear wall but because of room layout they are only an average of 46cm (because of the toe in). They sounded better as they were moved out but nevertheless sound pretty good. No boom with nearly all instruments and I love the rich bass from double bases and cellos etc. With church organ I would say that sound does not boom as such but probably I need a more powerful amplifier to get closer to the real thing. I recently bought a CD of Durufle which the Andrew Gallagher and Jeremy Summerly said was the best recorded church organ music they had ever heard and the organ in question was a monster! On the very lowest notes I seem to feel the sound through the floor and in my chest more than I hear it if that makes sense but I found that to be quite thrilling. On TV dramas when something bad is about to happen you often hear a low rumbling which again you feel in your body as much as hear but for me this is generally the only bit of these dramas,that my wife watches, that I enjoy.
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Is likely to be either the room with excessive decay time (maybe the B&Ws don’t roll off the bass as much, triggering this), or inadequate control by the amp (not sure how challenging a load the B&Ws are), or both. Room issues might be possible to mitigate, partially or wholly, by playing with positioning. If the drivers are new I would expect the suspension to loosen up a bit with use, which I think would be more likely to further extend the speakers’ low frequency response a little, rather than reduce anything.
The 802s in earlier generations could have a tendency to boom. This was successfully fixed in the D3 and even more so in the D4. One of the problems is the low impedance these speakers have, so this needs an amplifier to cope with this. My 500 when DRd helped.
For an organ record with “ample” bass try Anna Lapwood, Images, on the organ of Ely Cathedral play ing The Storm from Peter Grimes.
Once again, back to the room interface. Another reason for me apart from cost not to go for the 801
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Many thanks for all the feedback! I wonder whether the 802 does a better job at bass control than the 803 - better crossover perhaps?
I do recall that the 802 I briefly heard had a bit of a boom to it - but I don’t think many of these “demo” speakers are run in for long enough. By contrast the 801 Signature showed a very-well-controlled bass. (That might simply be a function of the larger drivers and less reliance on resonance - in which case the 802s should be less boomy than the 803s.)
The Chord Ultima 5 is an exceptionally-fast amplifier, and it’s so powerful this shouldn’t cause issues I would have thought.
For domestic reasons, I can’t move the speakers too far away from the fireplace, but can experiment a little more with placement - difficult at present as I have two competing sets of speakers - from competing dealers (!) - jostling for space in the “hot zone”.
I have an EMI recording of the Duruflé requiem from King’s (with John Butt playing the organ!). Incredible low bass there… But the boom I’m getting is more on orchestral music.
For some reason, the Serafinos - which have much smaller drivers than claimed (132mm vs 180mm) are able to generate very tight punch bass, whereas the 803s (153mm drivers c.f., 180mm claimed) are a bit vague lower down. Perhaps it’s the differing port strategies: rear rectangular ports on the Serafino vs a “bottom hole” (ahem) arrangement on the B&W.
Serious money.
Have you thought about Focal Sopra 3 or Wilson Benesch A.C.T. 3Zero?
No idea what they sound like with your electronics or classical music!
Both vetoed on aesthetic grounds I’m afraid; this is currently a two-horse race - very different styles of presentation, which is part of the problem. The Blades would have been a good compromise, but alas, deemed too tall and dominating…
What do you mean?
If you mean bass reflex speakers using a tuned enclosure/port to provide output below the driver resonant frequency, that applies equally to all the reflex speakers in the range, but with larger drivers and cabinets pushing the extension lower in the frequency range.
And the Nautilus on top of that.
Getting the best out of any speakers in a given room can be a challenge if you don’t have complete flexibility of placement. Ever since I had my first home of my own, choosing a house with a suitable room and getting the hi-fi right in it has always been the prime driver. It is relatively easy to fit everything else around… However my present house was more of a challenge, because although the lounge is a good size, it is an odd shape and I found the original imagined layout simply did not work acoustically, and I had to completely change the room layout. But the result is fine. If you don’t have much flexibility, then try whatever you can. Position of course also includes best listening position, not just speakers.
The other thing of course is that a lot of rooms would benefit from some degree of acoustic treatment – all the more so with the modern fashion of hard floors and minimalist furniture often precluding soft furnishings.
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Come on D.C just spend on the Amati G5’s set them up properly and enjoy the music.
You know it’s the best answer to this problem!
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Exactly. Much bigger driver in 801 so more direct radiation at typical wavelengths with port used only for really low frequencies.