Bitcoin ETFs are now available for everyone

which could be part of its value. the fact that it’s not traceable.

Bitcoin is by definition 100% traceable. It is the identity of the asset owner that is encrypted. Like the password to your phone being a secret, but it can be traced if you make a call.

hence not traceable for the important bits

Other than it is traceable without giving too much away, and bad actors usually identifiable depending on the complexity of laundering. You can’t keep a transaction secret with Bitcoin, it’s for all to see.
There are other cryptocurrencies that are not traceable… but they are niche

it’s the new Swiss bank account, as the old model is gone

I would suggest a Swiss bank account may be more secretive than Bitcoin…

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speaking from experience?

There’s no question that BC and some other established ‘tokens’ have attractions when it comes to fundamental aspects of security, and ledger control. But:

While you can critique the weaknesses and policy-making (esp. the politics) around FIAT currencies, these have governments stood behind with the visibility this provides. All I see with BC is a parallel means of exchange, based on simple demand & supply metrics, often with opacity around usage and who holds/owns it at any one point in time. It doesn’t define as a robust money substitute, as it doesn’t have any features which demonstrate an intrinsic ‘store of value’, as this is fundamentally speculative (there’s not even a bedrock value).

Plus, it’s not much use if it trends to illiquidity, which would also render it an unsuitable ‘mechanism for exchange’, which might easily be the case, especially if some ‘bad actors’ arise (if not already the case in its history?).

We’ve seen in the GFC and other more recent times that the central banks have struggled with global economic and monetary structures (e.g. money market funds), and I see crypto as a step beyond this, as while there should always be parties who want to work in it, it has nothing to underpin it, other than the speculative demand & supply aspects.

I dont own a Swiss bank account… but some of my family do… but alas they have nothing to be secretive about… that I am aware of at least :grinning:

That’s too bad. I love the visual of Jason Bourne emptying guns, cash, and passports into that velvet bag.

Oh, and some contact lenses too… :grinning:

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I see HMRC is chasing people for cgt on Bitcoin trading profits as apparently some don’t realize these profits are liable for tax.

I think most do that through an exchange if in the UK, and there are full records kept by the exchange; and full validated ID is required to set up an account. You would be have to be pretty dense to not realize you may be taxed if you exceed your tax free income allowance and your CGT allowance.
The taxation rules for trading are the same as for shares including the trading within 30 days, in many cases you can offset gains against cost as well.
As usual HMTC has many worked examples and details.

Cryptocurrency? Why? Does this thread really belong on the Naim forum?:thinking:

Because it’s in the lounge, and the proceeds from legally trading it have allowed some to buy Naim 552 based systems in the past…
Probably best not to be too snobby about it. Different people have saved different ways to buy their Naim systems….

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Lounge, baby. Lounge.

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I find it all too confusing and struggle to find a value in something that doesn’t seem to exist.

We’ve all heard stories of people making huge returns through crypto but we’ve also read the stories of people who have lost everything.

Guess gone are the days when cash was King. :grin:

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But it does exist. And it does have value. The point is that ‘investing’ in bitcoin is futile. Gambling in bitcoin is totally ok though. Which is what everyone is doing by putting their money there (unless ransoming hostages.)

And on cash, let’s not forget that a £ in 2008 bought two $. How’s that working out now?

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Not at all mean to be snobbish or anything, just was a bit surprised, thought most things around crypto were more or less scams but apparently I was wrong.

not a scam. but not a traditional investment vehicle either.

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The £ has always been overvalued imo.