I’m looking into ripping my very large (@3500) CD collection and also in future buying/downloading music, especially Hi-Res, I use Tidal so would have to download from HDTracks or similar websites and not Qobuz as won’t change from Tidal.
I’m looking for a one box solution (not PC or Mac computers) that will fit into my AV Rack and have a budget of about £5000.
The music server will be used with my Lumin P1 Streamer/DAC so I’m ruling out the Core as it does not work well with non-Naim equipment from the forum searches I have done.
Innuos Zen Mk3 or Zenith Mk3 get good reviews (Statement is out of the price range) so was looking for advice and recommendations on the Innuos models and also what other makes/models to consider, appreciating that the ripping and cataloguing software/app needs to be excellent.
Thanks in advance for your experience, advice and help.
The one box restriction is really limiting you. If you don’t want a big box pc then a laptop or MiniPC will give you access to Bandcamp, mp3tag etc etc and be far more flexible as well as giving you more choice for your streaming device.
Couldn’t agree more and you don’t want a pc style device in or around your hifi. They are noisy beasts in every sense. A modern pc or mac, a modern optical drive, acurate rip or equivalent software and some metadata tagging software are all you need to get accurate rips of your cds. But there are some one stop shops like Melco and Naim Core that have this stuff bundled. Never used them however.
Edit. And then get the media server as far away from your hifi rack as you can, through at least two switches and preferably in another room.
Just to add, you can also download from qobuz without subscription, though the prices are higher without a subscription but similar or better than I rember hd tracks to be.
I hate when people simply ignore what an OP says, but in this one case I’ll risk it. My original experience downloading from Qobuz was disastrous. The files kept disappearing from my computer. And when I figured out what was going on (and fortunately a workaround), the response from Qobuz was “works as intended.” On top of that, the source for one of the downloads was corrupt. I didn’t download again from them for several years.
But when I switched to Naim and realized that the only “hi-res” available from Tidal (at the time) was MQA, which Naim doesn’t support, I took another look at Qobuz. The downloader was much improved - I’ve not had any problems. And the prices for hi-res downloads for “Sublime” members is terrific.
May I pitch in with another recommendation?
A few years ago I auditioned a few solutions: moon, core, Melco. I was impressed with the sound but not the price. My solution was the Audiostore Prestige. It has not let me down, they have options at various price points and the owner, Martin Smith, has been helpful when I was trying to make a connection to my NDS and ‘Qutes. Give him a call.
I also use Qobuz and Bandcamp to download music I like rather than buy a cd.
I do think we are all in big trouble if music servers start sounding better than one another
They only really have one function at the software level which is to deliver a bit accurate stream to an audio streaming device from either an internet streaming service like qobuz/tidal, a digital download or an accurately ripped cd. And at the infrastructure level, this forum has provided loads of advice on how to minimise rf and em noise from said device.
In theory there should be no difference- but believe me, there are differences in servers, as there are in rips (ok - the latter is a very small difference) @badger1
On your system there will be a difference!
Edit: my comparison was some time ago. Maybe now (with sigma Ethernet cable) the difference is smaller. Last year when I tested melco n10 and zenith mk3 against num hdx, there was a difference
there can’t be a difference in an accurate cd rip that is, well, accurate and validated through error correction and checksum comparison agreeing with hundreds of people with the exact same cd.
And I would fall over in amazement if any music server could sound better than my version of roon running on an always on hp pro pc that is 6 rooms away and four switches away from a dedicated hifi switch! The last switch runs poe from a ubiquiti switch. And that is just as good as any music server should sound. It should never sound worse than this otherwise then something has gone wrong in the chain setup imho
Anyway good discussion and I hope this thread is giving the op food for thought!
Also a PC or mini-pc using dBpoweramp to rip and amend metadata, and AssetUPnP as the music server operating anywhere on the network would be and is my choice.
Shutout valid options if you will but at your loss. Would only cost £1000 and work beautifully.
Yes I am sure it is possible to isolate well any music server. Simon in this parish provided all the best advice over many years on the setup tricks and huge thanks to him! I have enjoyed all the ethernet cable threads even though I subscribe to the cables are not tone controls school of thinking - hence I use linn silvers for my audio cables (because linn voiced them for the frequency response of their sources) and just a decent spec cat6 cable into the linn ds.
However I heard the effect of rf/em noise distortion a while back when a live power cable was touching the cat6 cable I have running into my dedicated switch (a unifi flex mini). The voices suddenly went really harsh. I pulled my hifi system apart trying to locate the problem for ages until I thought to check the ethernet cables. I a/b tested the effect and it was shocking what a difference it made. Anyway, keep enjoying your music!
Edit - it is also possible some of the servers you tested are not bit perfect in their streaming. I wouldn’t know, having just used asset and roon, both recommended and certified by linn.
All servers have been bit perfect - nevertheless all sounded different as server only. Is it the noise - maybe. But that’s all I was telling.
And Ethernet cables do the same - is it noise - could be. But wh3n a cable or server is filtering away the noise … fine
Cool. Probably noise related then I would expect. Another good reason to keep the server miles away from the hifi rack! And implement as many noise reduction strategies you can manage.
Hi Paul. Has dbpoweramp incorporated accurate rip software nowadays? I haven’t ripped a cd since about 2018 simply because I stopped buying them and then I am sure they were different software but my recollection could be hazy, I recall I was using dbpoweramp to convert dsd recordings to pcm and flac at the time. And both mp3tag and dbpoweramp for tagging. I switched from EAC to accurate rip at some point as well because of the crowdsourcing. I remember back in 2008 when i first ripped cds with eac the only error correction was ripping the same sector 1000s of times - it used to take hours!
Many thanks for all the replies so far, its a diverse mix of approaches being presented, to add to them, another approach from my HiFi Shop:
I spoke to my long term dealer who sells both Innuos and Aurender as I was looking for advice on comparisons between the Innuos Zen Mk3 and Zenith Mk3 and also the equivalent Aurender ACS100 and ACS10 and what I was wanting to achieve by ripping my CD’s and downloading CD and Hi-Res music in the future.
He advised me not to waste my money, time and effort in buying new equipment and ripping my CD’s or buying downloads, he said they had done extensive back to back sound quality tests between ripped CD’s and downloads on music servers and streaming music (CD quality and Hi-Res) directly from Qobuz and Tidal and that there was basically no sound quality difference between them that they could reliably tell in their demo room, so advised me to just stick with my streaming from Tidal on my existing high quality streamer, so even less benefit and use getting an Innuos or Aurender as I don’t need the internet streaming functions of those devices.
He also advised that for mainstream music, the music library was excellent on Qobuz and Tidal so I would probably find any music that I wanted to listen too (which has been the case in my last 5 years of streaming from Tidal).
Also, he advised me that I have a very good (and 6 month old) CD Transport, so I can just play any of my CD’s anytime anyway.
So, I’m now re-thinking whether or not ripping my CD’s and buying downloads, is really that good an idea and the best way forward for my current situation.
