Do you believe that a streaming board can make no difference whatsoever to SQ as it’s also just passing on bit perfect data?
Yes exactly - in a system of separates. The streamer need only pass the bits to the DAC. So you can technically use a $50 Raspberry Pi.
Likewise when you use a Chromecast Audio (CCA) with the toslink optical output it will send pure digital music bits from the streaming service source backend into your digital input of your DAC/Amp. Toslink on the CCA has a bit of jitter but it’s corrected by most DACs.
I don’t doubt that you guys think you can hear a improved SQ when you use audiophile network cables but that’s down to cognitive bias and not some ethereal characteristic that science can’t explain.
Maybe the real answer is to find cheaper ways to trigger your cognitive biases.
3 Likes
I apologize, but you’re deluded. Your loss, our gain I suppose. A proper streamer with a good power supply will trounce the sound quality of a Pi or Chromecast.
1 Like
I find your find your comments interesting and disappointing that your cognitive bias is not allowing the possibility.
The evidence I present to you is after trying numerous switches and cables I settled on a ER belden set up. Then months later thought I’d try no switch. Immediately the sound was a lot sharper so much so I blew the bmr’s on my s800s, playing a lower volume than often played.
Proof to me that there is a substantial difference, and the listener can fine tune the preferred sonic presentation.
1 Like
Pauel, everybody is allowed to have their opinion. But I would suggest you give it a listen yourself. I have spent 4500 euros on a Ethernet cable and found it a good investment given the sound difference. And I am not swimming in money, so it’s not because I am snobby about it.
So give it a listen, if you can’t convince yourself - also ok…, but realize there is more to cables then just bits and bytes (noise, shielding…).
3 Likes
I’m just looking for the proper explanation. As I said, cables can add both positive and negative interference depending on the system build.
However, the root cause is never in cables but in the device implementation details.
Say, the easiest example - cables sometimes works as the grounding. Yes, grounding does impact on SQ. So, I invested in the grounding cables - made it myself for about 5 pounds in total. The root cause is not cables but the implementation of the power supply of your device.
There might be different cause, not just this one. To me it is just a good example.
Another example - look at nd555 power supply. Such approach means that power supply chain impacts on the SQ. In some cases when you add cables, the negative impact of router is gone. And the root cause is an internal issue that makes possible the router to interfere with your, say, dac, preamp, or power amp.
Crikey! I hope it didn’t take long for you to get them repaired. Are you still using the Sotm clock with the ER? I haven’t had time to follow up on this yet, but I’m tempted for the lower box solution of the PhoenixNet, though I may listen to the Chord DACs at the same time, so I don’t end up with a great Ethernet solution but find I then go down a USB route…
Well as you say, it could be ground, it could be PSU etc. All these things make an impact. And you are implicitly recognising that this is not a “bits are bits” situation, which is what everyone else is also saying. You could be closer to them than you believe…
Hi again Michaelb. Yes it was all quickly fixed with the usual excellent Naim and Audio t service.
Yes still using the sotm clock, the system has been untouched for a year since the bar incident and sounding great. My ears have pricked up though with the innuos phoenix, it looks very interesting especially has it has the internal Sean Jacobs power supply.
1 Like
How real do the instruments sound?
How well does the music hang together?
How enjoyable is it?
After reading all of this I have taken the plunge and ordered some Catsnake 6A from the UK… despite BJC being on the same continent. 
I needed a 10M length though, so will be interesting to see how that works out as I am still fussing with stereo placement in my apartment.
I’ll report back vs. the extremely old CAT5 I can’t even remember the name of (lol) into my NDX5S → SuperNAIT.
My take is simple: I cannot say an Ethernet cable has ever really made any kind of ‘improvement’ (on this I may be more in the camp of it’s 0s and 1s debate); analog (whether interconnects, digital or PC), however, has made some interesting differences, but none have been ‘better’ than any other…just ‘different’. What that means to one’s current system synergy only that person can answer, and thusly is typically perceived as better. I’ve had cheap(er) versions on certain systems that I perceived to be more synergistic at the time than more expensive or supposedly better-designed ones and vise-versa.
As for switches, I’m a little less skeptical than I am about Ethernet cables. I’ve done some documentation on it here, but even then the benefits are pretty minor but perceivable enough for me to think they ‘can’ make a difference in one’s system.
All-in-all, I don’t really have much of a dog or dogs in this fight, as I just think tweaking to this level becomes a bit overkill and detracts from really enjoying music versus just listening to it. I have come to the conclusion that getting one’s power and system as clean as possible is going to yield the greatest benefits than any Ethernet cable or switch; and oddly enough it’ll likely cost less and satisfy you more than the merry-go-round or expense of these cables and switches. This is just my opinion, humble as it is. If you believe these things to lift your system or excitement, then who am I to discourage such a thing? Little moments of happiness are so few and far between these days…live and let live I say.
4 Likes
I believe some things in audio reproduction are more complex than simple bits. In reality for a computer a 0 and a 1 in the end is always that. But in audio the cables change the final result, it is what it is. And I will be happy if a entry level cable sounded as good as an expensive one, unfortunately for me was not the case.
In the network the power supply changes the sound, the power cable of the switch or server changes the sound, and the network cable also changes the sound. Even if the 0 and the 1 that travels between all the network devices in the end is the same.
But if we never try for ourselves we will never find if that is the case in the context of our system.
2 Likes
I know there are probably a million threads like it, but I find this thread incredibly useful and interesting.
It’s like a Hollywood Movie - intrigue, revelations, joy, sorrow, anger, odd characters appearing and disappearing, mad theories, quasi science presented well, ACTUAL science presented over simplistically, passion, getting to the end and still not knowing what’s going on…
It’s all here.
I can see Roland Emmerich buying the rights.
But really - this content is why I’m a regular at the forum.
It just needs a love story😁
You old softy. 
1 Like
Time to sit back and break out the popcorn.
1 Like
I’ve come back for a second helping. Let me put it simply.
The music you stream from Tidal, Spotify etc needs to travel through 10,000’s of kms of fibre optic and copper wire, 100s of firewalls, routers and switches to get to your home or phone in the first place.
…And you think the last 6 feet of that make all the difference with your ‘fancy Ethernet cable’?
And the earth is flat too? Well, of course it is!
Funny I use to think the same until I installed a EE8 and some decent cables from it to my streamers. Even a luddite like me could hear the difference, guess until you actually try it you can’t really judge. But hay that’s just my opinion.
8 Likes