Inconsistency

I have compared ATC 19 and 40 passive to Sonus Faber Olympica. Found the ATC more on the neutral / analytical side, vs softer and more textured Sonus Faber.
Have no experience with Kudos. But reading you, I am not tempted.

Never heard of Elbow before but they are sounding excellent on Spotify. Thanks for that.

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I’ve found the SCM19s to be the warmest of the speakers I’ve listened to in this room. I definitely get a sense they are a little rolled off in the highs. It’s probably a room thing as well. In a larger room the 19’s might not seem warm at all. I assume the OP’s listening room isn’t particularly large, hence the choice of SCM11s and I’m sure here the 19s will better fill out the lower registers, despite the small difference in frequency response indicated on the ATC website.

Maybe the 19 are the warmest in the range, but I think they don’t forgive bad or average recordings.
Too clinical for my tastes.
Neutral but they lack some textures and colours.
And I wonder if the 300 dr is not overkill for them too.

I run the Proac Tablette 10 Signatures, which are generally considered to be on the “fast” side, and that is precisely why I love them. However, that can make them unforgiving at times. The problem, as has oft been said so far on this thread, is the recordings.

My taste is mainly guitar based rock, running from the 70s to current Bandcamp wannabes. The quality of recording is often nothing to do with the production budget. King King have recorded albums on a budget that wouldn’t cover a Premiership footballer’s wages for a week, yet they sound clean, tight and energetic. Exile and Grace is a great example of transparent sound on a sensible budget. But there were mainstream artists in the 80s and 90s (such as Heart on their self-titled 1985 release) who had massive budgets and the production was simply dreadful. That album in particular sounds so thin, despite the pomp of some of the tracks.

It’s the same issue as the difference between live performances and recordings. Some acts are great in the studio, but totally lack presence on stage (I so remember Texas in the early 90s and their inability to get a crowd going), while others are amazing live but not so hot when faced with a mixing desk.

Just enjoy the music, where you are, in the way you want. If it sounds poor at home and good in the car, listen to it there and tap the steering wheel in time (paying due attention to the road of course :slight_smile: ) New speakers won’t make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear.

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Actually the 40s are warmer than the 19s.

As for speakers that “forgive” bad recordings, if this means sugar coating or smoothing out the production, that is absolutely not what I want from my system. If the sound engineers go to great lengths to capture, say, an orchestra and the acoustic effects of the hall in which it is playing, I want to hear that. If a violin player plays a note sforzando, I want to hear the way the bow impacts on the string. I want a system which clearly distinguishes between makes of piano and the location in which it is being played. All these bring me closer to the music and the musicians. Of course, as @davidhendon says, that can mean revealing how poor some albums are, but I’m happy to opt for honesty in reproduction. And like @anon4489532 I can ‘listen through’ a poor recording if the quality of the music is high enough. Some classic early recordings made in the 1930s are cases in point. But I guess we all want different things from our systems.

Where I do disagree is the assertion that ATC speakers “lack textures and colours”. To my ears it is the almost physical way they do reproduce the colour and texture of an instrument, all the way from a simple recorder to a grand piano, that is one of their great strengths and what drew me to them in the first place. But my set are active which I guess does make a significant difference.

Rgoer

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My experience was while comparing vs Sonus Faber Olympica 2, on a same system, at dealer place. Bryston electronics. 30 m2 room.
19 and 40 passive, against the Olympica.
I found the ATC lean and lacking emotional connection, vs the Sonus Faber.
I don’t like soft and syrupy sound neither.

But it doesn’t hurt. :grin:

I just added a Uniti Nova to my second system. It replaced a Squeezebox Touch, TEAC UD-301 DAC, and Cambridge Audio Azur 840A amp. Speakers are 20 year old Thiel 1.5s.

Things sound . . . different. The system is more revealing with greater detail. Soundstage is improved even though the speakers are not optimally place (not possible). Violins can become irritating. I hear some treble edginess elsewhere. Deep bass is more prominent and can be overwhelming. (I am not a bass head.)

But, but - well-recorded albums sound better than ever. Not only my AP Blue Note SACDs and my Bob Dylan and Frank Sinatra MFSLs, but plenty of discs (or more precisely rips) from non-audiophile labels. “Hearts & Bones” and “Porcelain.” The Emerson String Quartet playing Beethoven. The Decca Analog box. And there are surprises. I listened to Miles at the Plugged Nickel courtesy of Tidal. Not sure of the quality overall, but Miles’s unmuted trumpet leapt out of the speakers into the room with me.

And another thing - I am still within the first 20 hours of usage, and I can hear improvement. Maybe in the electronics or maybe I’m just adjusting (or both).

Some good observations on this thread and I can identify with many of them. I think my rekindled interest in jazz stems from the fact that I now have a system up and running again after a few years of a Bose one piece. I now appreciate the jazz albums more maybe because in general terms I feel they are better recorded. The Bose system just glossed over them.
I do however find some albums in the mainstream rock / pop genre sound ok in the car but are ruthlessly exposed on my home system.
The end result is that I play those albums in the car but I don’t bother with them at home, where subtle detail shines through.

I do have a few Mofi albums but it’s also amazing that obviously poor quality recordings or ones that have been played on my Amstrad with tuppence on the headshell can still be thoroughly enjoyable.
As my system has improved I now appreciate albums or tracks that I wasn’t overly keen on previously.

How has that happened? :thinking::slightly_smiling_face:

Your Nova will still be running in but given your mention of harshness I’d be checking your tweeters. I replaced the tweeters on my Naim Credos which were of a similar age and the difference was astonishing.

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Just had a listen to the King King and Heart albums you mention. Not previously familiar with either of them but they illustrate the point perfectly. Heart is a really difficult listen. The word ‘hollow’ springs to mind.

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Let me give them some more time.

Also, after Jim Thiel died in 2009, his company was purchased by a hedge fund, which (as I understand it) threw out his designs and quickly drove the company out of business. Replacing parts for a 20 year old speaker (replaced by the 1.6 within a year after my purchase) may not be easy.

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I have never heard Oasis sound good in my car, or at home, even though I generally like their music. It is to the point that whenever one of their songs come on the radio, I have to turn it down immediately…very poor recording.Green day, I don’t really listen to them much, so the quality does not matter. However, Audioslave and the Chilli Peppers usually sound pretty good to me in the car, or at home.
That is the problem with high end stereo’s in general, they need to be fed quality recordings to justify their cost. I remember not long ago, a member here (Zachwater I think) was upset that he could not get Led Zeppelin’s “Kashmir” to sound good on his $100 K + system. Sadly, the answer is, it probably never will.

I listened to Audioslave again last night and it sounded pretty good but needed cranking up a bit.

Feeling a lot more relaxed already about the inconsistencies after reading everyone’s comments.

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This thread reminds me of a dem I had years ago. I wanted to hear the drums properly on Champagne Supernova. A big ask, and sadly unsuccessful.

I think you need a mental reset of how you listen Stu. You have a wonderful system that will extract most of the music available. Enjoy the music rather than just the sounds it makes. Yes, texture and timbre are important, trouser flapping bass on dub essential, but whatever just listen to the music knowing that it will never sound much better no matter how much you spend. I occasionally listen to an album because I love the production, but I will always play all of my recordings regardless of SQ.

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Physiology is an important component of sq.

I’m already enjoying my music so much more. Huge appreciation for all your replies.

I feel it’s not about what we hear, but how we process it. And my processing is a lot healthier now than when I started this tread.

If the thread has stopped you listening to Oasis then our work has not been in vain. :slight_smile:

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:joy:

Very good point – @frenchrooster hit the nail, I think. I would look at getting new speakers that allow you to enjoy a broader range of recordings.

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