Good point, the totals appear to match on the Zenith, however, I think, and I stress think, some are missing from the Naim App UPNP view… (Inc latest beta).
Probably a more forensic search is called for, although all 500+ albums imported successfully apparently, so I suspect it is more of a view issue between the Innuos dashboard and the app UPNP view.
More interestingly, have you looked at the album art associated with the artists/composers view…?
ATB,
KR, J
And good luck with the Roon trial, let us know how it goes.
I had the Zen running as Server for 5 days before activating the Roon trial, so I did have a good feel for how the import had gone.
I hadn’t thought that maybe some albums may be missing in the App view, I guess with 700+ albums I would struggle to identify if that had been the case though as we both seem to have found, the numbers seem to add up.
In terms of album art, as far as I’m aware all art that was saved in the metadata of the original file transferred over, at least I think it did!
Once in Roon though there is a setting relating to cover art that does allow a changed view if the resolution isn’t high enough for example. This updated quite a few album covers to covers that I wasn’t necessarily happy with, but it’s easy enough to swap back or swap to an alternative when I get round to it.
I’m still getting my head round Roon so I’ll post back in a week or two once I’ve got used to the functionality as that will be a fairer reflection.
Ps. With Roon running the Zen doesn’t present as a Server in the Naim App so I can’t cross check what I’m seeing in it, sorry!
So I think I have got to the bottom of this, although I haven’t the faintest idea what to do about it.
All 500+ albums are visible on the Innuos dashboard Music Library browse albums view, but…
On the Naim App, some are visible on the UPNP Album All Album view whilst others are only visible on the Artist view…
This has to be a metadata issue, but I haven’t the beginnings of an idea as to what - maybe just live with it, although, no surprise, the US did not exhibit this behaviour, but then only had 100 or so directly ripped albums.
You could use a metadata editor to examine the files in detail. In theory, I guess you could use the Innuos to view them, but I’m thinking of something like Matadatics (OSX) or MP3tag (Windows) might show you exactly what’s going on. If, that is, the metadata is to blame here.
I used the Import from NAS/Network Storage option which didnt give any options as far as I can remember.
So is there a direct correlation between the ones that were directly ripped and the ones you are seeing in the Naim App?
Or is it all the ones that werent directly ripped on the Unitiserve?
Or is it unfortunately not as straightforward as that?
If you can identify which ones are missing and work out the pattern, that should help get to the solution, I know it is rarely as easy as that though!
All the albums appear in all Music Library views on the Zenith dashboard with apparently valid metadata.
But… on the Naim side of the house;
Not all albums appear in the All Albums UPNP view of the Zenith Music Library
However, for those tested, missing albums DO appear in the Alphabetical UPNP view, eg H…
And indeed also appear if I use the remote to select albums/tracks from the UPNP (Zenith) source from my UQ front display, which matches 3 above.
(I used the 6 albums from the Hobbit soundtracks by Howard Shore for this test, although the Naim conflates the tracks from The Desolation of Smaug into a single album instead of a Disc 1/ Disc 2 pair)
As this is exactly duplicated by the latest Naim App beta, I shall raise a bug and we’ll see what happens?
“Tidal for me has been an opportunity to assess new releases before deciding whether to buy or not but, quite often, it’s so good that you question whether you really do need to buy.”
“No, Tidal streaming is ultimately not as good as rips or downloads”
Hi Dave and Others
I’m seriously considering getting the Zenith Mk3 now.
As you say it will improve my Tidal streaming.
And for the stuff I really like (Trichotomy, Brad Mehldau, GoGo Penguin, ECM) I will buy hi res downloads (or CDs).
(Plus I can rip my few hundred old CDs that are in the garage.)
So a couple of Qs:
Can you say any more about how much better hi res downloads and rips are than Tidal? I’m still concerned that I might be jumping on the NAS bandwagon just as it becomes pointless to own music because the difference between Tidal and streaming from a Zenith seems to be vanishing!
What app do you use to control the Zenith? Will I still be able to use the Naim app (e.g via Twonky)?
How is your Innuos Zenith Mk III working with your NAC-N 272?
Do your hi res files (and CD rips) sound much better than Tidal (or Qobuz)?
Also - do you save files in WAV? This should work well with the 272 I think - as people often want to feed a 272 with WAV to take the processing pressure off the DAC.
Do you have it plugged into the 272 via ethernet cable?
What app do you use to control it?
I have Zenith Mk 2 into nDAC/ 555DR via Audiophilleo + PurePower usb to spdif. I’ve tried Qobuz hires a bit and was disappointed. I have good 36Mbps broadband but only one Cisco which only connects to Zenith. Ordinary 44/16 sounds super. I’ve yet to buy hires downloads.
So you mainly buy CDs and rip them on the Zenith?
Or buy 16/44 downloads from Qobuz?
Do you stream from Tidal or Qobuz?
Have you ever A/B tested a streamed Tidal or Qobuz track vs the exact same recording and bit rate as a download (or rip) on your Zenith to see if you can tell the difference?
Because if there is no audible difference there’s less point in buying a Zenith for me - although it will still improve my Tidal stream too.
Also - do you save in WAV or FLAC on the Zenith? Does the nDAC also prefer being fed WAV, like the 272?
How is your Innuos Zenith Mk III working with your NAC-N 272?
Really well, great SQ, indecipherable from my CDX2!
Do your hi res files (and CD rips) sound much better than Tidal (or Qobuz)?
Hmmmm… yes, better than Spotify, not currently subscribed to Tidal or Qobuz.
Also - do you save files in WAV? This should work well with the 272 I think - as people often want to feed a 272 with WAV to take the processing pressure off the DAC.
Files saved as FLAC, inc converting previous US library. Appears to work really well with the Zenith and 272.
Do you have it plugged into the 272 via ethernet cable?
Both via Ethernet and USB, latter playing through a Meridian Explorer DAC’s optical output.
What app do you use to control it?
Naim App for UPNP, iPeng for USB playback.
Hope that helps, don’t think you’ll be disappointed. BTW, Zenith is a significant step up from the Zen.
Hi @JimDog
I recently purchased a Zen MkIII which feeds my NDS and replaced my 2011 Unitiserve.
The Innuos pops up on the Naim App as a server so the same detail is available to select as with any other option (eg. nAS, Core, Unitiserve, etc)
I subscribe to Tidal, rip CDs to the Zen, and import Hi Res downloads to it also.
Local streaming sounds better than Tidal in my opinion.
I’m trialling Roon at the moment and that does change things a little, but if that isn’t on your radar, local streaming is better than Tidal as I say.
Thanks - v useful.
Can you say a bit more about that Meridian Explorer connection.
Are you using a Toslink cable to the 272 from that??
How does it sound compared to the ethernet route?
What source is the music coming from in that usb route?
Oh that’s good - because I love the Naim app!
Do you think the Naim app will sense the Zenith in the same way?
So are you mainly streaming from Tidal or playing local files and rips?
Jim, I don’t stream other than trials. CD rips are better than TIDAL, which is very good. I will buy a download hires sometime. I’m happy to take SiS’s view on Qobuz being better. Not sure how Innuos deals with TIDAL MQA. Obviously with my configuration I’m not dependent on a Naim streamer or Roon, which I liked on the Innuos. Not bothered about DSP stuff in Roon.
Thanks again, Phil.
That’s a relief!
Have you forensically compared the same Tidal recording and file streamed vs a locally stored rip?
Or is this just an overall impression based on your free trials of Tidal?
