It’s not just about cheap or expensive ethernet cables. Three 5 quid cables could all sound different.
It doesn’t affect the digital stream reaching the DAC but adds noise to the analogue stages. SiS covered all this in previous discussions.
GIYF 
I certainly appreciate SiS’s knowledge on these topics, but i also recognize he often describes theoretical situations when it comes to interference, distortion or artifacts. I assume that in theory em noise could enter a streamer through a network cable and find it’s way to the analogue output stage somehow. But the question is: does it really, to what degree, and what are the effects?
Does it result in any measurable effects in practical situations? And if so, what would be the difference in distortion introduced in the output signal between simple network equipment (unmanaged switch and standard ethernet cable) and expensive equipment (audiophile switch and cable).
Without any real measurements or data it would only be a speculative claim that wouldn’t warrant buying special network equipment to try to alleviate it.
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In my experience, it does.
I have to admit I was quite sceptical about the difference an ER or EE could bring comparing to my main switch.
I ended up with an ER and a LPS.
It makes a difference. Surprisingly, it makes quite a difference.
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Ok thanks… I must admit I have perused the AES library of papers and studies of the time of the practicalities of working in and developing 96/24 systems and I haven’t seen one single reference to DCS.
One example of audio mastering practicalities in 96/24 using early technology
Mr Stuart of Meridian now MQA gets a fair few references.
@litemotiv It’s cheap enough to purchase a used Cisco 2960 and various network cables off fleabay then you can try it yourself.
Dual AES?
Like I said just repeating what is said on the dCS factory tour on YouTube
Quite a bit of info on there, I wouldn’t think for a moment the guy is making it up.
Except Naim does tell you to install a separate spur. I guess that’s not something made by a competitor.
Like Dunc I am a recent convert to dCS this past year with a Rossini/Master Clock. Prior to that I used, and still own, a Linn Klimax DS.
This topic came up multiple times during my years on the Linn forum from 2011 until its recent demise. Linn’s reply was always the same as dCS. I guess great companies which make great products know what they are doing - like Naim.
The recommendation has always been to have a robust wired network with compliant and certified ethernet cables and switches. The rest will be taken care of once the data hits the inside of these extremely well engineered products.
Sorry but for me I will take the word of the substantialy staffed engineering departments of world class companies such as dCS, Linn and Naim over the two guys in a garage at Sonore, Uptone etc. Just saying.
Best
Gregg
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I think the comparison here is immunity.
People try to sell us things which “improve” our immunity but fail to mention that they are only relevant if you have compromised immunity in the first place. If your immune system is fine then nothing you buy can improve it.
If your network is flaky, and that is not necessarily manifested solely as dropouts, then there are several changes which can improve that. That may well lead to a conclusion that sound quality has been “improved” when in fact all that’s happened is that you’re now hearing what you ought to have been hearing I’m the first place i.e. you’re back at baseline.
That change might be a cable, a switch or whatever but those items are not improving sound quality per se. They’re improving your sound quality. Thus you can legitimately say that, for you, that item has improved your system/sound quality but others will then, and I think this is especially true of network switches and Ethernet cables, try those things looking for an uplift which, for them, will not exist.
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There’s the brand blablabla, as always, be it Naim, DCS, or little companies as Uptone. They all don’t recommend additional tweaks or components to perform their products. It’s advertising.
And there are consumers who test themselves.
As for DCS, in for example Whatsbestforum, the majority of the guys using Rossini or Vivaldi have also audiophile switches with linear ps and expensive ethernet cables. Some use Sonore optical modules with ER, other are stacking ER or Sotm, or use Melco or Telegartner switch.
I don’t think they are fooled by their brains .
Hmmmn… Just the guys using dCS in the Whatsbestforum?
Sounds just like the guys in the Naim forum😉
I don’t understand what you mean by just. I was referring only to DCS because of above discussions here.
But of course, other have MSB, Emm Labs, or others expensive dacs. And of course they use too these network tweaks.
As for Naim, I rarely find someone using it in that forum. Outside Europe, Naim is not very represented.
I have two Cisco 2960 switches in my home network which replaced two TP-Link consumer switches.
I changed to the Cisco switches (bought second hand and reset to default configuration) because I needed additional ports, not because I expected an uplift in sound quality in any of my systems.
In line with my expectations, I was not aware of any changes in sound quality in my streaming systems after made the swap - Linn Klimax DS/1 and microRendu/Mytek Brooklyn DAC+.
I believe you. Some find no difference using ER, EE, or Cisco. But it doesn’t mean that these switches have no impact in general.
I agreed with you, most of the people who bought into the audiophile switches are the ones who had some kind of dodgy home networks in the first place. So in my view, it is most important that you have a solid home network before investing in any expensive streamer, otherwise it would be better to have a turntable or a cd player.
Great post. Love the analogy of compromised immunity.
.sjb
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And this as well - the world’s first 24/96 analogue-to-digital converter amongst other accomplishments
Sure… but I think a lot of people around the globe contributed to the development 96 kHz / 24 bit… it was a bit of a holy grail … and many manufacturers like to show off their ‘firsts’ in this area, for understandable reasons.
the hybrid DSD format DXD they may well have been more specifically involved with Sony …again I can’t see a dcs reference anywhere. obvious but possibly more specialised.
AES is the Audio Engineering Society which has memberships of the leading research institutions and manufacturing and research companies around the world which is the body that supports research and development of audio engineering for industrial, commercial and consumer applications. Its library is fascinating as you can use it to chart the development and understanding of how we hear and understand audio, as well digital and analogue audio recording, storage, transmission (including data networks) and replay methods over the decades.
If you are interested in the science, engineering, development, research and leading thinking about audio, rather than rely on manufacturers’ marketing depts, its well worth joining.
Sure your right simon, but i will just go with the evidence thats above in this thread, thanks