Here an article saying it won’t be released soon , or even much later.
But if that happens, will you be able to buy or stream that AI music ?
Jazz is the expression of human improvisation and imagination. The why I like it.
Personally I am not keen at all to listen to that kind of music.
And you?
1 Like
I’ve listened to some AI-generated music, and it’s all be run-of-the-mill fine, but not awful. I’m sure at some point AI will generate music that is better, more listenable, and perhaps even indistinguishable from the “real” thing. But that’s not the point: I don’t want to listen to or watch a computer algorithm make music. Kraftwerk perform nearly motionless on stage behind computer consoles, but you can feel, sense, whatever the soul/heart/emotion/brain of the people behind the music. Maybe the same when you look at a painting, see the brush strokes, and sense the human hand, and mind, behind it. Without that, maybe art loses its human tether; I don’t believe it could ever hit the same.
4 Likes
I consider machine learning to be exactly the same as facial recognition i.e. there is no safe or accountable use case and, as better people than I have noted, it needs to be treated as plutonium.
TBH, listening to most new ‘ambient’ and jazz stuff (let alone pop) I think AI is already firmly in control. It all sounds very nice (audiophiles love it it seems) but has little spark or that awkward, blazing, fiery creativity of human thought behind it.
3 Likes
There are non fiery, blazing jazz players who put just as much human emotion into their music.
2 Likes
I doubt audiophiles listen to ambient elevator supermarket jazz, but I may be wrong. But yes, this kind of binary jazz AI is certainly capable.
Will we see one day John AI Coltrane ?
Well, it couldn’t be any worse than some jazz made by humans to my ears
I suspect that could be a minority opinion on this forum and will be a minority view in this thread.
2 Likes
Lol, ‘blazing and fiery’ related to the human spirit, Bob.
But I take your point. Yes, there are, well, were…
Back in the mid-90s, I remember a Music Technology undergraduate of my acquaintance writing a piece of code that would improvise in a jazz style on any chord progression you gave it. Listening to it do its thing, it was fairly convincing even back then. He was a jolly talented chap.
Mark
Certainly not the best jazz music. I remain unconvinced that AI will create great are whether jazz music, Bob Newhart’s delicious telephone routunes or Clause Monet paintings.
Given that jazz to me is mostly unpleasant and at best just bearable, AI might improve it…
The question, however, is valid in respect of any musical compositions and their performance (as opposed to, for example, formulaic manufactured pop).
Would I listen? I expect so if it sounds good, stirring emotions (and so doing what human compositions & performances do).
Do I think it is a good thing? My inherent reaction is no.
1 Like
I wonder where AI music might sit in terms of copyright? Does the instruction "create a song in the style of Hey Jude constitute plagiarism? (I suppose the law will need amending.)
This debate is nicely summarised in the many words of Benedict Evans on the matter. Already it’s been appreciated that machine learning requires training data and at i resent it’s largely taking this for nothing so arguments about cost and fair use are beginning to play out.
Machine learning is just that though. It’s only as good as the data it’s fed and has no way to distinguish between good or bad data. Already the owners of good data are saying “you have stolen this for profit so either pay or you’re banned”. That approach isn’t going to change much so the value of machine learning after the initial hype is likely to reduce.
This can be seen in health where it’s becoming apparent that the many claims of “can more accurately detect cancer x” are rapidly being exposed as biased; overstated and lacking in any transparency as well as almost always still requiring human input.
In music it’s forseeable that artists revolt will largely kill it. Sure, some artists who see themselves as “forward thinking” will be trying to use it using the naive “it’s just another new tool in the kit bag” argument with no thought as to the impact on fellow artists. One only has to look at how this is playing out at Spotify. They’re struggling to launch even a basic CD quality service and in part that’s because they find themselves firefighting an onslaught of AI created music which is robbing both them and artists of money. Spotify doesn’t give a hoot about the artists but it’s already fragile financial, only ever one controversial podcast idiot away from a major dent, can’t survive them paying out for music which hasn’t been created by humans. The means to tackle that will ultimately make it harder for humans to get streams live and do real damage.
Thus my earlier comment re: plutonium to use a phrase from Ben Stark.
Will machine learning he able to approximate jazz? It already can? Will it create great jazz? That’s arguably in the eye of the beholder but realistically none of us should want it to get to that stage because if it does then your fave artists records have already been screwed over either for a large amount of money or nothing at all and new artists will have even less chance to succeed.
All this made far worse by the fact that people with a vested interested interest such as TV companies, film companies and advertisers will absolutely encourage this because who wants to pay humans when you can undercut them once more.
Be careful what you wish for.
5 Likes
I believe humans do as well. Much of this data, and a lot of information comes for free for young humans but of course, the parents pay their taxes or school fees to get the bits of data humans can’t get for free. However, I do believe that AI developers do need to pay for the use of copyrighted materials.
The recent Jazz disc “London Brew”, sounds anything but “nice”.
Hmmm…I will replay London Brew. On first and only playing I wasn’t impressed.
Compared to Bitches I thought it was decidedly lacklustre.
But…fair’s fair… I’ll give it another listen.
1 Like
Like Bitches Brew, you need to be in the right frame of mind.
Bitches Brew is not among my favourite Miles Davis recordings, I much prefer “In a Silent Way” or “Your Under Arrest”, if we are talking about his electric period.
All About Jazz had a very similar article.
I believe no AI solution can ever match the inventiveness of a talented composer.
But I guess paint by numbers pop and other easy listening music is fair game. As the link explains, AI will mean even bigger profits for music providers, as all the players needed to make a record are not needed anymore.
Not involved, unfortunately, by London Brew.
There’s only one Miles spirit. The only one who could give something approaching is Henry Kaiser, with its Yo Miles trilogy.
Other may have another tastes.
1 Like
Funny how it is claimed AI will free up humans from drudgery to pursue creative goals instead. Yet from film and television, to music and art, AI is coming for the creative stuff and leaving the drudgery to us.
1 Like