I’m listening to Andre Gagnon on the Marten while typing this. Music never sounded this good. Very lifelike and involving.
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If yours act anything like mine, you have improvements still to come over the coming months. The areas you mentioned, being a bit fatiguing and maybe lacking a bit of bass will come good, especially the former. These are the least tiring speakers I’ve ever had but being so revealing, I did have to pay more attention to details with cables, power and external influences.
It’s fun working them all out though and the end result is sublime. I believe I have extracted all I can from the Nova, so changes afoot later this month.
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Agreed. The Marten Duke 2 although highly transparent, detailed and revealing is still very musical with low listening fatigue. It’s surely not a lean sounding speaker but has a rather full and lush sound without sacrificing on detail. My earlier comment on the higher listening fatigue in comparison with the Harbeth, the difference is actually very subtle. In summary, the Duke 2 is a very balanced speaker which doesn’t sound too lean and bright, or the opposite end of the spectrum warm and lush.
Another aspect I discovered about the Marten Duke 2 is it’s quite sensitive to placement in the room. Initially I found the sound to be a little bright so I pushed the speakers further apart with less toe-in. It’s a very slight adjustment, perhaps a 50mm shift in placement but the sound quality changes for the better. Reduced glare or brightness and sounding more precise and balanced.
The bass quality is very good for the size. Natural and accurate sounding bass without being too excessive or bloated. However, size does matter and it doesn’t have the visceral low bass of the Harbeth SHL5+ although it goes lower on paper (38Hz in comparison to 40Hz of the Harbeth). It’s the quantity of bass that’s the issue here, and the difference is perfectly comprehensible as the SHL5+ is about 3 times larger in volume than the Duke 2 if not more.
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Ryder- please keep us informed, my system 282/250dr/hcdr mirrors yours exactly and (like you) bought speakers based mostly on reviews and reading, but mine are Harbeth M30.1, which I’ve had for a couple of years now and have no intention of changing- but…., so keep reviewing over time.
Benjy, yes we use the same amps - 282/250DR/HCDR which is a good thing since I find the amps to be very accomplished and involving at a rather “down-to-earth” price which doesn’t break the bank (although others might disagree). The sweet spot in Naim’s range in my view.
Right, down to business. Although I do not have extensive experience with the Harbeth M30 series, I have a fairly good idea how it sounds like in comparison to the SHL5 and SHL5+ which I currently own. The original M30 is my least favourite speaker as I find it to sound too warm and shut-in, lacking in clarity and detail. The M30.1 sounds much better, more open and balanced with better clarity. Everything is better from clarity, openness in treble and bass. M30.2 again more open and more extended in the treble but Haloweenman will be able to provide more insight on both M30.1 and 30.2.
The Marten Duke 2 sounds more like the M30.1/30.2 than the SHL5+. The presentation of the Marten is more vivid, more lifelike than the Harbeth SHL5+. The sound of instruments such as piano, violin, viola, cello etc. extends out more from the speakers. The tonality of the Marten is slightly richer and more energetic than the Harbeth SHL5+. In comparison, the SHL5+ plays a little safe as instruments do not leap out as much and sound a little recessed. The SHL5+ tone is slightly pale in comaprison to the Duke 2.
Now, the M30.1/30.2 is different from the Harbeth SHL5+ as it also sounds like the Marten Duke 2. It’s not a like to like comparison since my experience with Harbeth M30.1, 30.2 and Duke 2 is in different rooms with different amplification and sources. Nevertheless, if I were to describe on the differences between the Duke2 and M30.1/30.2, I would think that the Duke2 has more airiness to the sound, an overall lighter presentation. The M30.1/30.2 just like any other Harbeth has the old romantic Harbeth sound. Difficult to describe in words but I guess you know it since you are an owner. The sound signature of the Harbeth is distinctive. The Marten house sound is more modern, not as romantic but still sounding warm and lush.
It may sound contradictory. ALthough the Harbeth and Marten may sound different, the difference is actually not too far apart which is actually a good thing. If the difference is too far apart, I wouldn’t have kept both speakers but get rid of one. Both are very musical and involving speakers. Different sound but still engaging and musical.
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Due to the current lockdown, I may find some time to switch to the standard Naim cables both interconnects and NACA5 and see how the system would sound like. I currently use Chord cabling throughout, Signature TA interconnects and Signature XL speaker cable.
The Duke 2 continues to impress. I didn’t expect the speakers to sound this musical considering that they have Accuton ceramic drivers. They don’t sound forced or sharp at the edges or have an overly detailed, lean or thin sound that is synonymous with most high-end speakers out there. In this respect I actually feel the Marten Duke 2 sounds a lot like the Harbeth - warm, soothing, musical and rounded at the edges with low listening fatigue. With all the good similarities, the main difference between the Marten and Harbeth is in the tonal quality. Instruments such as piano, violins etc. sound more lit, live and vibrant. Apart from the tone, the Duke sounds more 3-dimensional and has more air but that could be due to the smaller size of the cabinet which helps with imaging when compared to the larger box of the Super HL5+.
Overall, a great and musical sounding speaker. The Duke 2 is not exactly cheap but it’s worth it not only for the sound quality but looks as well.
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Just connected a PMC TLE1 subwoofer to the Marten Duke 2 since I miss the low end punch of the Harbeth SHL5+. Results are pretty good.
Spoiler alert.
With the Marten Duke 2, I currently find the NAC202 to have a more balanced and neutral tone than the NAC282 resulting in a more enjoyable listening session. Selection of music is purely classical piano. Both preamps connected to Hicap DR and NAP250DR.
The tone of piano sounds a tad bright and illuminating with 282. I will try jazz fusion and other music genres later.
With Harbeth SHL5+ the 282 sounds better than 202 due to the more natural tone of the speakers. The Marten is quite lit in its tonality and the 282 may have compounded the effect.
Interesting assessments and views, some I can relate to, others not at all. Remembering my room is quite small and I sit just under 2m away, I have found positioning very critical to all aspects and getting the balance across frequency ranges and creating a strong image and soundstage has taken some time. I do think it’s due to the small room though as whenever I audition new kit with the Dukes at the dealers, where the room is much larger (and treated), they don’t seem so fussy at all. At home, every change I make in the music chain usually means having to tweak the position again.
However, once set, it all comes together and sounds incredible. I couldn’t cope with any more bass in my room than I get and, the trait you see I can’t relate to, it never sounds too bight and I could not apply any of the usual negative adjectives such as harsh or grainy to the top end.
What I do know is that if I do experience some unpleasantness it’s because of something else in the chain and I now have confidence in the speakers and can hunt down the offending source elsewhere (which I also have spent a lot of time doing).
You’re lucky to have two pairs of great sounding speakers so enjoy!
Thanks for the post which I surely can relate to. Please allow me to clarify as the message conveyed earlier may be misinterpreted.
You are absolutely correct that the Marten Duke 2 does not sound harsh, grainy or bright. The midrange and treble of the Marten sound silky
smooth. There is no sibilance in vocals and nothing grates the ears.
When I mentioned the Dukes to sound a little bright, I was largely referring to the tone of the piano. Piano sounds slightly lit and more forward when compared to the Harbeth. There isn’t any hint of grain or harshness with the Marten but it shows a glowing lit energy with instruments such as piano and flute. Sort of a tube - like glow. In comparison, with the Harbeth piano sounds slightly less lit without the glowing energy of the Marten. This particular difference in tonal quality is not exactly night and day but appreciable nevertheless.
More notes. There isn’t any criticism of the Marten really. I actually find both Harbeth and Marten to sound rather similar - musical without sounding lean, thin and overly detailed or analytical. Both speakers sound incredibly smooth with little to negligible sibilance in human voices.
The bass of the Duke 2 is very balanced and adequate, no criticism. It’s just that it lacks a bit of punch in comparison to the larger Harbeth speaker. Size does matter but I could live with the Marten without a sub. The crossover is set lower at about 58Hz (down from 67Hz) for a more seamless integration.
I have gone back to the NAC282 which again proved to be a more enjoyable listen than the NAC202.
Lastly, the Harbeth is now compared to the Marten side by side. From the photos below, the physical difference in size between both speakers is quite obvious. Both sound very good. No winner or loser.
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Very interesting, you write well describing the characteristics of both speakers. I hope didn’t come across as a Marten fan-boy (although I am one), no speaker is perfect and everyone has different views and preferences that make this hobby fun.
I hadn’t realised quite the difference in size until your last picture, those would swap my little room!
I forgot to mention that I tried listening at 2.0m away from the speakers but still prefer listening at a considerable distance away from the speakers.
Listening distance from speakers measured from front of speaker to ears is 3.0m to 3.5m.
I would if I could…
on looks- the Harbeth’s
David
I share your enthusiasm on the Duke 2. Most online reviews of the Marten Duke 2 have been rather spot on. I am beginning to appreciate the strengths of the Dukes the more I listen to these speakers.
I largely agree with the points you mentioned above. The Duke 2 is super smooth and not a forward sounding speaker. The kick drums and dynamic transients in the background don’t leap out and assault your ears as much as other forward sounding speakers. The overall delivery or presentation is highly delicate and refined. In this sense even more refined than the Harbeth.
The Marten Duke 2 is not exactly a “rock speaker”. No doubt it can play rock reasonably well but those looking for hard thumping bass and dynamics in rock music are better off looking elsewhere. For the music that I mainly enjoy such as smooth jazz, classical piano, jazz fusion, vocals and modern pop the Duke 2 is rather perfect.
Again, I agree that positioning is critical with these speakers. I just settled with a new speaker placement after I found the sound to be a tad bright and unbalanced. I pushed the speakers further apart and reduced toe-in. They now have very little toe-in, about 1.95m apart, 50cm away from side walls and 63cm from the front wall. They are sounding wonderful now, very balanced and musical and yes, super smooth. I still use a subwoofer to reinforce the deep bass though. A subtle but worthwhile improvement in beefing up the low bass punch in the room with crossover frequency set at 50Hz. My room is not exactly small and the sub does help in providing that extra bit of punch.
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Words I would use to describe the Duke 2;
Super smooth, warm, light, delicate, refined, detailed, musical
The sound of percussion and drums is very nice. Delicate and refined without sounding harsh or metallic.
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An update. These speakers need ample space from the front wall. Very sensitive to placement. Previously at 63cm, the speakers are now pushed further out into the room after I felt something didn’t sound quite right - the sound had a certain paleness and soundstage was rather narrow or small. The speakers now have about 72cm from the front wall and the sound became larger and enveloping. Notes suddenly sound more energetic and lively. The slight lacklustre or pale sound is now gone, replaced by a richer tone.
Speaker placement is of paramount importance as I’ve learned through out the years. It is surprising that the Marten Duke 2 requires even more space from the wall behind it in comparison to the Harbeth Super HL5+. Perhaps the rear port of the Duke 2 is one of the reasons it requires more space from the front wall.
From The-Ear online review, the reviewer settled with 75cm, pretty close to my 72cm. I will try to experiment further with placement sometime in the near future but the speakers are sounding great at the current position.
Hi, thought I’d post this. It’s useful to know that you’re currently using the Chord Hugo TT2 as a preamp to drive the Nova.
I’ve been busy comparing the 202/200 to the 282/250DR on the Duke 2 and came to my own conclusion. The 202/200 is noticeably inferior to the 282/250DR and I cannot recommend the former to be matched to the Marten. The Duke 2 sounded poor with the 202/200. The 282/250DR is much better but it’s still not quite an optimised setup to me. I will try the Sonneteer Orton integrated on the Marten when I get it back from the repairer soon.
Your intention of trying the NAP 250DR may be a good plan. It is good to know that the Marten sounds great driven by Chord Hugo TT/Nova and you don’t have plans to go with dedicated preamps such as the 202 or 282.
Hi,
I had actually been using the Mojo via the Nova as I make the steps towards where I want to be. It helped me decide that I like the Chord approach to DAC’s. It was very listenable, but as has been pointed out, the Nova converts all inputs to digital anyway, so maybe wasn’t the best representation of the Chord sound.
I have however since acquired a TT2 and am currently driving the Dukes directly without any power amp. It is remarkable that in Amp mode it is able to do this especially as the Dukes aren’t the most efficient speakers. How does it sound…? Well all the good traits of the TT2 are there, the clarity, detail, layering etc but it lacks image and soundstage so I’ve had to play around with speaker positions. It will go louder than one reasonably needs but sounds a bit rough at the loud end of the scale. The bass is actually better than I expected and is very tuneful.
This is definitely a temporary situation, NAP250 still my fave option on paper, but I do glance at Ttoby as it matches the TT2. However, I think I still need some Naim in my life…