In the 90’s the Mana tables took this concept to an even more extream level. Have you seen the photo with the 25+ sub frames under someone’s stand? They seem to work on using a cascade principle of similar mass? If you’ve not heard the Mana effect then youve not heard how well bits of wood, glass and metal can isolate a piece of equipment. Their system worked on speakers as well.
Nor me, I asked a professor of Physics from Liverpool university once about it, he thought it might be micro variations in the magnetic field around wires and components caused by any vibration but that was an off the cuff remark with no real thought but it seemed feasible enough to me at the time and ever since.
IMHO supports are 50% myth and 50% something else.
Not to say that they don’t work (as the Fraim clearly works well) but I’m not sure the science is well understood.
Unless you live close to a railroad or something similar, I think the main sources of vibrations are the big transformers in the components themselves. Some feature very large toroids, a certain company from Salisbury is known for theirs. Draining them and even more, keeping them away from other pieces is, at least in my view, the most important thing for a rack.
I agree about the main sources of vibration, although I think bass can affect your turntable if sited close to the speakers.
I’m not sure about the concept of draining vibration though. I could be wrong but I just can’t see it and have never come across the concept in my industry or any other environment where sources of vibration occur.
I personally file that under ‘myth’ until I read a paper that explains otherwise.
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You are right about the cartridge as an exception. Regarding the draining, pleas take a look at the resonator technology inside the Finite Elemente Master Reference racks.
Thanks. I had a read of an article that went into the chaps history and technology he uses. It doesn’t seem to have anything to do with draining but managing resonances, which is what I mentioned earlier.
finite-elemente
His website explains exactly what I’m trying to say. It’s more like vibration control via damping.
IMHO draining is not a ‘thing’ as I don’t think it’s possible to drain any vibration from a source. Even if it were possible, it would have zero effect on the components that are located adjacent to the source of vibration e.g. a transformer. It’s like replacing your engine mounts with spikes and ball bearings, sitting in the car, idling the engine and expecting not to feel any effects. All you can do is manage it via damping or tuning.
In the case of helicopters, for instance, there aren’t many options but to manage the vibrations and FEA is used to ensure the structure or any other equipment (missiles for instance) don’t have any natural frequencies that are anywhere near the blade passing frequencies etc. The same applies with aircraft, spacecraft and I use FEA for exactly that purpose i.e. to manage vibration.
Vibration will always find its way to ground if there’s a route. This isn’t draining. The Fraim will have some inherent damping from its construction but has no damping introduced to convert vibration to heat (as per the Finite Elemente racks). So quite different to the FE product.
If a transformer is the main and detrimental source of vibration in Naim equipment then there’s not much you can do, which is why I maintain that their equipment sounds perfectly acceptable without a dedicated support. It would be financial suicide (not to mention horrific engineering) for Naim not to manage the vibrations at the equipment level. However, this is quite different from saying that the sound can’t be improved upon. Which brings me back to tuning. If you don’t have damping and can’t drain vibration away, the only thing you have left is tuning, which is what (I suspect) the Fraim does rather effectively (in addition to spacing of components).
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This is why I was thinking that the “Ring” of the glass platform that is supposed to occur when tapped, indicating proper setup, is the key to how it is supposed to work. Maybe it dissipates the vibrations from the transformer and stops vibrations coming in from elsewhere. Either way, it is achievable to make a resonating glass platform in a much cheaper way. I simply cannot afford a fraim and they are also not to my taste. I try to use real wood, mainly hardwood, wherever possible in my place so it just wouldn’t look right.
Also, probably overkill for an atom!!
I think you’re onto something with the ‘Ring’ as that frequency will be relevant. However, it’ll also be based on the relationship with the MDF shelf that it sits on and placing of the three ball bearings.
It definitely would be possible to design a platform but it’d be trial and error due to all the other interactions. If playing around is your thing though it’s definitely worth a go.
Personally I really like the look of the Fraim but think it would be huge overkill for my Nova.
At some stage I quite fancy modelling up a Fraim, seeing what the modal characteristics are and then seeing if I can replicate it but just don’t have time at the moment.
Richard has edited my previous post (apologies BTW) as I’d linked to the Finite Elemente website but it’s worth reading the chaps work as he’s definitely the first person I’ve read up on that actually makes some sense.
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Cheers I’ll take a look.
Hi end
Be it cars , mountain bike , hi Fi or wot ever
Some of it is the ( Emperors clothes) not all
I look at it like this , it’s my money I can spend
How I like ,
As we all do. I’m not sure how your requirement to spend your own money relates to the post you’ve quoted though. That post simply highlighted the way that Naim gear always requires just a bit more, even as you walk out of the shop with your arms full of a Naim box the reality is that the job’s not complete.
You spend your money. No-one’s stopping you.
Iam afraid your incorrect, it’s not so much name gear that requires more as much the person whom is buying it , which Iam well guilty of and my post is very relevant, as the OP is being told to upgrade by someone who as not heard wot his setup sounds like
Still anxiously waiting in these difficult times. I’m just hoping it will be weeks rather than months. I went for Natural Ash with Black Spacers in the end. 
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Have just updated to ash fraims/fraimlites with black uprights from total black
It looks sensational, so much better
Cheers
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Just do not polish your balls too hard, over-polishing can make your listening chair less comfortable…
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…I know, have to stand up these days for listening…
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I have a component (and Isol-8 power substation) that’s too deep for the Fraim - the back feet just hang off - but it otherwise fits. So I’m going to order a new piece of glass.
I’m intrigued by what you’ve said here - as I’m keen to understand what “Naim Spec” is so I can source one.
Dimensions are easy enough, but toughening spec? …smoking spec? …bevelling?
There is clearly more to glass than meets the eye - but I’m sure there are people here that know this stuff and can help?!?
Before i ordered full Fraim i did look at the cheaper options such as Fraim Lite and then adding the other gubbins such as balls & cups, glass etc… After doing the maths it turned out that i was saving around £560 over the full Fraim. Anyway cut a long story short i went the whole hog instead, it just wasn’t enough of a saving for me to want to cut corners…then there’s the double base to consider too with which in itself must bring a significant improvement over the single base.
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I’m sure you’ll love your Fraim, Stephen.
I haven’t regretted mine for a second, despite those damn back balls rolling off if I try and adjust a box in situ!
We’ll need to start thinking of that second base, Mana-style layering, that was mentioned!
There is no end! Lol…
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