It’s just a statistical fact that in blind tests, the overwhelming majority of people cannot hear the difference between these things.
Above a certain price point that is. When you cross over the line where equipment is ‘good’, then it’s really really hard to blindly tell which piece is ‘better’. At that point it’s just a matter of taste, first and foremost.
Your ears are the only things that need be satisfied, so it seems to rather miss the point not to rely on them to make a judgment.
Naim have always encouraged you to do the dem with your dealer, to trust your own ears and choose what sounds best to you; what gets the hairs on your arms prickling, your toes tapping, your arm conducting, what allows you to fully appreciate who is playing what and how, what makes you want to keep on listening and not do something else instead. That’s pretty much the only measure of what sounds good to you or not.
I already told you I’d leave you to your beliefs. Which is the nonsense here.
I’ve rejected more expensive and/or newer kit at dealers before.
Richard summed up perfectly how I would judge stuff.
A lot of ‘hifi demonstrations’ have left me unconvinced on ‘sound quality’, and other factors influenced the decision to buy. But there have been a (very) few instances where everything has fallen into place and, yes, I did know it when I heard it!
The only Naim (show) demo I ever heard was not one of them - it was just bloody loud! Odd, that.
Back the original subject of whether a good used buy, there was a related topic “Legacy users unite - How do you modernise your streamer” which would be relevant for a purchase of used NDS.
This was my answer on how to
It’s just that with high end audio, a lot of what we hear is determined by what we see and what we are told, which includes boxes and price tags. It is very difficult to listen to equipment objectively, or neutrally. Perhaps even more difficult with a dealer around who is kindly advising us what to consider.
If that is so, then surely it is all the more reason why you should trust your ears.
I’m not really sure Richard… 
If i see two DAC’s in my dealer’s room, one costing 2500,- and one costing 5000,-, it will be very difficult to ‘hear’ the most affordable one. My brain will keep telling me that surely the 5000,- one sounds better, because there would otherwise be no reason for it to be twice as expensive…
This thread has been turned into a poison pit by a few overreaching comments long ago!
And once again I find myself put up against the wall by both sides. You probably know my position on this, but anyways:
I do understand your points and don’t think that they are entirely wrong. Our ears are amazingly sensitive for certain things, but they are not objective measurement devices.
At the same time, I do not think that short blind tests in pressure situations (necessarily created by a formal test by itself) are an appropriate way to evaluate these things. Anne-Sophie Mutter, some conductor, and another classical musician failed to reliably distinguish a Stradivarius from an entry-level violin in a blind test in a German TV show. What I conclude is that these tests are not able to measure what they claim.
I would probably fail in many such A/B tests. Just these days I compared the CDS3/XPS2 (as it is finally set up) with the NDX2/555, not blind. The first evening I found the difference not night-and-day but clear, and I had a favorite. The next evening I didn’t really hear any.
Yet, there is absolutely no doubt that the current system is immensely better than the NAD C658 streamer and Rotel 1080 power amp I had before. Which were puny in the context of the forum but certainly “good”. Same speakers. I can hear the difference, I can feel the physical sensations in my body, and I feel my connection to the music. Apart from myself, the new one leaves friends with an open mouth who have absolutely no stakes in it (yes, I have occasional visitors under strict quarantine protocols). One evening my wife came over to check out the new system. She is a kitchen-radio-good-enough person but has known all my systems and lived with some (and shook her head). I played her a tune and by the end of the song she had literal tears in her eyes, saying she had never heard anything as beautiful before. She asked me to repeat the price (again ) and commented “oh well, but the result is 
” (approximated - she didn’t use a word but made a face and a sound).
(We both have our own money and use it as we see fit, so no stakes in this either. And I can assure you, nothing like this ever happened before! 
)
If you trust your emotional response, just as Richard so well described, it’s easy to work out which you prefer, irrespective of price. I’ve heard some very very expensive systems that have made no emotional connection. On paper they may be better, on price they should be better, but in practice they were not. It’s just about trusting your own judgement, and choosing on emotion rather than price or specification. You must let the heart rule the head.
If that is the case then may i kindly suggest that you’re not trusting your own ears.
I miss going to HiFi shows where cost wasn’t an issue as one has a free reign to hear what hits the spot and what doesn’t, regardless of the environment.
Richard is right. Trust your ears. Price is nothing to do with it. If it sounds better to you, then it is better and once you have made that decision, stick with it until your ears tell you something different.
There will always be something which your ears prefer, and which you cannot afford, but there’s a great deal of pleasure to be had before hitting that buffer!
I agree with litemotive that it is at least terribly hard to separate. There are no “our ears” and “our brain”, it is a tightly coupled interdependent psycho-acoustic system, and the “psycho-” part is influenced by many things
I think we all have brains that function in this way to a degree.
More expensive = it sounds betters
Bigger box = it sounds better
Better design = it sounds better
Dealer tells us it’s good = it sounds better
etc.
Some people may be more succesful in blocking out those influences than others though…
Sorry but i disagree here, it should always come down to one’s own ears, otherwise your’e putting yourself in a vulnerable position, especially around a savvy salesman at least.
The brain is far, far more powerful than the ears.
I remember an piece of modern art where we saw a dog barking on a video screen. A friend asked the next room if I did hear the dog, I said yes, but there was no sound at all. It was entirely constructed by imagination.
Well it should, but is a fact that we don’t work this way. If we did, mankind would not have had a need to develop scientific measurement systems and statistics at all, we could just rely on our feelings.
Stu, having a similar set up to yours: my NDX needed service. I got a played in NDX2 to listen just for an hour (PS555DR was warmed up): more space, more detail, but the sound was ,too cold’. Harsh. Not to my taste at all. Bought an NDS used a couple of months later. Less space, more rhythm, warmer, rounder sound, …perfectly happy with it. Admittedly I only want to download from Qobuz, if at all. Also stream Tidal through Apple TV/optical cable…
