I’ve looked into going from ND5XS to XS2 but I really enjoy using the physical remote so that is a showstopper to me. Sure, I can unlock the phone, wait for the app to open and sync and then do adjustment but that adds 5 seconds at least to changing a track and to me that is a worse user experience. 5s I have but I hate to mess around to make simple things like changing track or volume.
I’m with you. using Naim app on my iPhone is a horrible user experience. It’s kludgy and slow. I never use it, except to change settings on my NDX2, and that happens rarely. I use the Zigbee remote all the time.
My main complaint is the system automation is flawed. If my preamp is on the phono input it won’t always switch to the NDX2 input when I start playing it. Restarting the NDX2 usually fixes it, but only temporarily. I hope they fix that.
Its worth considering that shortly Naim will have Qobuz integration with 24 hit recording requiring no MQA by unfolding by Roon.
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I don’t have a Roon Nucleus, but I suspect the advice is good. I have system upstairs and downstairs and he is advocating something like my upstairs system. I have a Mac mini and its USB interface goes in to Chord DAC - I use JRiver MC instead of Roon to play music.
Many will disagree, but in my opinion this gives better results than using a streamer because I could spend more on the DAC.
I would suggest it is definitely worth investigating. A good dealer could help here, demo options and let you decide which you like best. @Innocent_Bystander plays his music this way, but uses Audirvana as his player. Several folk, including @james_n, have a Roon Nucleus, and may be able to comment on if this would work for you.
Had a quick look at Roon Nucleus and it appears you can USB out into a DAC of your choice given the DAC supports USB Audio 2.0. There are ways even if the DAC doesn’t support asynchronous USB audio.
Qobuz doesn’t encode in MQA. I use it with Roon. There is no MQA unfolding involved. TIDAL uses MQA.
Another vote for the ND5 XS2. I compared both through an SN2, and didn’t hear any significant difference – as in none. I dunno, maybe I need to upgrade my ears. Anyhow, they’re both wonderful, but I already voted with my credit card, and used the money I saved to splurge on more Quadraspire (Mrs. Bhoyo can’t stand Fraim).
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I’m in agreement with @nbpf. Long term wise, separating the dac from the transport makes sense to me. Get the best sounding dac to your ears and system and then attach a transport like the Primare NP5 or the Allo DigiOne/DigiOne Signature to it. The transports are not overly expensive and can be replaced easily in the future if they end up redundant.
I get that some people don’t want to do this for box count or for simplicity sake though. I have a DigiOne transport attached to my NDX via BNC, works great. The NDX alone still does the job, I have another alternative though with the DigiOne.
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What is somewhat hilarious here is that Naim offers two streamer/DACS; one is twice the price of the other and neither is inexpensive. The least expensive Naim streamer (ND5XS2) costs nearly 3000 euros and the quasi-unanimous consensus on this thread is that the NDX2 is massively preferred for SQ reasons. I conclude that the ND5XS2 is grossly overpriced and should cost no more than 1200 euros in terms of VFM for SQ.
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I try to avoid reasoning in terms of money and value for money, because the value of money is itself very relative.
Judgements about sound quality are also very subjective and relative. At least most (if not all) of those who have listened to the ND5 XS 2 and to the NDX 2 tend to agree that the NDX 2 sounds better. In which sense and by which margin is of course again very subjective, but the consensus is reassuring. I tend to think that both the ND5 XS 2 and the NDX 2 are solid and rewarding propositions.
It also appears that the new streaming platform is significantly more flexible and able to cope with different protocols and specifications than the one of the previous generation of Naim streamers. This is also reassuring.
Still, I believe that it is legitimate to question what is the added value of these devices over an old Naim DAC, especially for the NDX 2. According to what has been reported in this forum, it is not the case that the NDX 2 is very obviously better than the old nDAC in terms of sound quality.
The ND5 XS 2 and the NDX 2 add to the SPDIF inputs of the nDAC a streaming platform with wired and wireless interfaces and a display. So what? A little box like the NP5 or the DigiOne Signature provides the same functionalities in a more flexible and mature software system.
I am not arguing that the NDX 2 is not a good value for money. But if I had to choose between the NDX 2 and the ND5 XS 2 without being able to carefully demo them, I would go for the latter. At least it has no display that can freeze or that cannot be switched off.
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I went for the ND5 XS2 (with an SN2). Can’t say I heard a big improvement over sound but to be fair I didn’t test both in home with the same set of speakers. But my personal assessment came down to value for money. I felt that the nd5 represented a lot better value vs the incremental SQ the ndx2 could provide to these cloth ears. I might have liked the option to upgrade the power supply but the XPS is not a cheap unit - so here in the states those two boxes together retail at a staggering (for me) $14,000.
I do actually like the screen on the NDX2 - but as for the remote, I use roon to control everything I need and occasionally I’ll reach for the SN2 remote to mute if it’s closer to hand than my iPad.
So I’ll conclude by saying that it was more about priorities for where I could spend that difference in price… such as a nac 282 
… Does it ever end?
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To @vinylbrother ‘s point on the potential redundancy using a roon Nucleus and adding a Naim streamer/DAC.
I am now using my roon Nucleus+ (ex-demo purchase) direct into my Chord TT2 DAC via USB, with Tidal, Internet Radio and Melco as my main sources. I am using two Audioquest Jitterbugs in the USB chain (a definite improvement for a cheap outlay), and I am trialling a Mutec 3+ reclocker USB. I am connecting the Nucleus into the network via the Melco’s Ethernet player port which is in turn linked to a Cisco 2960 switch.
I sold my (excellent streamer/functionality, bland DAC) ND5 XS2 to fund the Nucleus since the DAC in my ND5 XS2 was already redundant, and the streamer capability in the Melco should soon include a firmware upgrade so it becomes a roon end-point (Melco have gone quiet on this recently). I also upgraded from a Muso Qb1 to Qb2 as part of this changeover to move from Naim to roon multiroom
I accept that a full-price Nucleus+ is not cost-optimal against a NUC or a MacMini as the roon Core, indeed I had already ordered the NUC components when the ex-demo opportunity came up on the Nucleus. Power supplies and USB jitter are an endless topic set.
I have tried playing, via roon, locally stored files on an SSD in the Nucleus (moderate SQ, possibly due to power supply, which I have not changed) vs. those held and processed from the Melco via roon (better SQ), as well as direct streaming into the DAC from the Melco without roon (best SQ). The SQ for Tidal and Internet Radio via roon Nucleus+ is strong.
Splitting the components in this way gives more flexibility as streaming and DAC technology evolves faster than amplification technology. There is however a proliferation of smaller boxes, some of which can be hidden. Multiple power supplies, and upgradeitis in this area, are an irritation.
There are certainly other routes to adopting streaming with or without roon and the DAC choice is personal - the Naim nDAC with an external USB/SPDIF interface is one option, splitting the Roon Core and End-point functionality with a Naim or non-Naim streamer is another (there are many debates on this too…).
Adopting a NDX2 with the OP’s SN3 and existing roon Nucleus remains a strong and simple option, although the XPSDR may be desired to enhance the NDX2.
Interesting and logical reasoning. Wonder how close Naim is to revising/expanding their current streamer offerings. Probably too soon, but obsolesence in this domain is looming…
Thanks! I hope that they will come out with a DAC 2 before my nDAC dies but I am not in a hurry!
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I would think if they are having to find a new DAC chip that building nDAC V2 would be a good exercise. I love my nDAC driven by the Innuos Zenith.
Phil
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I would like to see, from Naim:-
An upgraded Uniti Core that is also a roon Core
A streamer/bridge-only with roon end-point, UPnP, AirPlay2, Chromecast, Bluetooth (no DAC), with multiple digital inputs and outputs
A new nDAC or DAC V2 - with USB inputs
These might need a (common?) external power supply to achieve hi-fi levels of SQ.
All in a consistent half-width form factor (like the Atom) which would not dominate a room visually in a way that a full rack of Classic boxes does, and still enable an upgrade path with Naim.
My rationale is that many people are now in ‘compact living’ and do not have space for full-sized gear, or want the visual impact of multiple full-size black boxes; also the trend to active speakers will probably increase to support people who have started out with Sonos, HomePod and even Muso and those who want simplification.
On the integrated side, in the Uniti range a ‘SuperNova’ (discussed elsewhere in this village) and also an Atom with digital-out and improved amplification would support a more flexible ‘one-box’ architecture, and also second-system multiroom deployment (roon and Naim) continuing alongside the Muso range.
I would expect that Naim & Focal product development and marketing will have considered all of the above, and even have prototypes in the lab - whether they will ever see the light of day is another matter linked to market research and sales performance in the existing ranges.
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Having recently auditioned the NDX2 against the ND5 I would say it is considerably better, more than justifying the extra cost. I would also say that adding the XPS DR is a further improvement justifying more additional cost.
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Have you compared the NDX 2 to the ND5 XS 2 or to the ND5 XS? Thanks, nbpf
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100% agree.
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ND5 XS2 latest model.
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