NDX WiFi Signal repeatedly dropped - It's driving me mad!

Streaming Audio
1

After three routers and two broadband providers I am turning to the community for support.

When my CD player died a year ago I decided to go digital and get a streaming player; a display model NDX.

While I was delighted with the sound, I would be sitting listening to FLAC files from my NAS when it would just stop. This also happened with Tidal files, but not when listen to HD files from a USB drive.

Talking the problem through with the Naim dealer, they suggest that I try upgrading the firmware to 4.7 as there had been reports of problems listening to Tidal. I did this without improvement.

I also talked to my broadband supplier who sent me a new router to see if that would help. It didn’t. Changing network supplier and a third router still hasn’t solved the problem. This is what happened yesterday, which is typical.

Yesterday, after about an hour of listening, the music just stopped and started, stopped and started, every 20 or 30 seconds. As this went on for sometime I was able to take a video of the problem and do some tests. Using my laptop I logged on to the router interface and tried the following.

Test Number.

  1. Logged on to the router interface and changed the Wi-Fi channel on the router, (3 different channels).
  2. Monitored the signal strength from the router next to the NDX.
  3. Switched off my mobile phone (which I had used for the video).
  4. Switched off the signal to the NDX using the router interface.

Results

Test 1. Changing the channel made no difference to the interruption on the reception by the NDX.

Test 2. The signal strength next to the router didn’t change by more that a few percent, with an average of about 80%.

Test 3. Switching off the phone made no difference.

Test4. After switching off the signal to the NDX, using the router interface, the music continued for approximately 2-3 seconds before it stopped. (This is presumably the buffer period, which was longer that I had expected.) After the connection was lost, and registered so on the NDX, I got the message, “No Network Connection”. At this stage, I reopened the connection to the NDX from the router interface. Once the Wi-Fi connection was re-established, the music played. The very rapid switching on and off stopped, however, I did have a single further disconnection before I finished listening.

Can you think of anything that I can try to understand the problem further. The dealer has spoken with Naim and they say its a router signal problem. I didn’t see an big change in the signal strenght when all this was happening. What else can I try?

Note: I have tried using wifi over power line, however both the Zylex and BT units burnout (got very hot and stopped working) and I’d need an 11m Cat 5 cable to connect the router to the NDX. That or router the cable around the outside of the house.

2

This would be my suggestion. A basic Cat5e cable at minimal cost will almost certainly perform better than your current wifi setup. 11m is well within the limits of an Ethernet cable.

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3

I’ve always had my NDX ethernet wired, via a switch from NAS.
During a period of room refurb I had it over wireless & although OK, it did drop out every once in a while, much as you describe.
So for me the obvious solution is to run an ethernet.
I would go for a Cat6 or Cat6a rather than Cat5e, if you go outside, make sure the cable is suitable for that, more especially so if its in direct sunlight.
Alternative is to change the position of the wifi hub, I did this & it was the best ÂŁ130 ever. The BT guy ripped out all the old extensions (needed for fax & business extensions), a new BT cable & the inbox positioned where we really need the wifi hub & master phone to be.
Jobs a good’un

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4

It’s what I did once I had a Naim streamer downstairs. Cat 6 suitable for outdoors from Cable Monkey and a plumber mate of mine with a suitably long drill to get through the wall.

Very pleased and also means my NAS bos is now wired to upstairs which is handy for the odd large file transfer that I ned to do.

5

I routed a critical ethernet cable outside the house myself. It’s about 10m and its any old ethernet, not anything special. It’s not in direct sun ever and so the fact it isn’t outdoor cable doesn’t matter at all. It just works. It cost me about £10 for the cable and another £10 for a suitable drill bit.

Best

David

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6

I was lucky and have an air brick in the living room for the log burner…ethernet cable just threads through. Its the way to go if you can.

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7

As others have said, the wlan implementation in the first gen streamers was less than stellar, which prompted most to use Ethernet . Much improved in the current products so less of an issue, and even preferential to use wifi in some circumstances.

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8

As an out-of-the-box idea - literally - you might want to try this inexpensive streaming project. See my 2 posts here.

I’ve owned a Muso-2 for a year now and I can attest the Wifi on even new Naim components does not always perform as expected. I needed to go wired on my Muso.

.

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9

Many thanks to all of you who have taken the time to respond and help me with my problem. It seems that most folks have given up with the wireless and hard wired to the router. That’s what I’ll do.

I did like Mike33’s alternative using a Rasberry Pi. I think that I will do this as a bit of fun and see what happens.

First time I have been disappointed with a Naim product. I expect it just to work.

10

I find MESH Wi-Fi stems to be very good.

As most MESH devices also have a couple of Ethernet ports on them you could place once of the nodes near your Naim and connect it via Ethernet cable. Given good (tri-band) MESH systems will have a separate 5GHz back-channel for node to node transmission it should be almost as good as running a Ethernet cable direct.

The Netgear Orbi MESH systems see to be the most reliable overall.

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11

Hi XMB, I’m not disagreeing with your endorsement of MESH system, I’ve just added a WiFi Disc to my BT SmartHub2, the coverage was OK without it, but its significantly better with.
The problem in this threads case (I believe) is not the wireless coverage as such, when I had my NDX on wireless for a just a few evenings (see my previous post) the NDX was only about 3m from the wireless hub & in the same room, it dropped connections every now & then, but when the refurb work was finished I was back to ethernet & problem solved.

12

I gave up using WiFi with my Nova, and now NDX2, but an Ethernet cable back to the internet router just isn’t an option - I missed the chance to route one when we did a refurb 2 years ago.

What I have done instead is locate a wifi repeater near to the system (BT Total WiFi disk in my case, but many options are available - just make sure to get one with an Ethernet port) and I connect my NDX2 to the Ethernet port on the repeater.

Works a treat, no more drop-outs or other issues, and we get a great WiFi signal throughout the house too now

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That is why I said to connect the Naim via an Ethernet cable to a MESH node. Then it uses Ethernet to the Naim and the Wi-Fi is handled by the MESH system. This is faster and more reliable than using an extender (power-line or Wi-Fi).

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14

Its already been suggested to wire the connection, your post, as understood it, suggested to try to improve wifi with MESH. Cross purposes maybe … whatever a wired connection is always best

15

I do the same but with Eero products. Dropped connections are a thing of the past for me now with either hi-res files or locally streamed files.

16

If your NDX is about 11 metres away from your wifi router, the signal will almost certainly be borderline.
I have a Muso-QB in my garage with the wifi access point being around 30 feet away, with only a studded wall between it and the QB. When I look at the web interface for the Muso-QB (by entering its IP address) the signal strength shows as “marginal”.
It “usually” plays “OK” but I do plan to move the access point closer or, connect the QB by a cable.

17

The router is about 5m away with only a ceiling between the two. The 11m of cable is to route the wire around the walls on the outside of the house. All the other devices in the room work well. Before the NDX I used a Sonos Connect in the same position. I just think that the wireless connection in my NDX is either faulty or just not very good. I am very frustrated that I can’t always link to the NDX with my iPad. Does hard wiring the NDX to the router solve this issue as well?

18

Do you still have your Sonos connect?

I ask as for a while I used my NDX connected to the Ethernet socket of the Sonos.

The Sonos mesh network is separate to your wireless network and I found that it made for a very reliable connection.

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The Sonos can operate in two wireless network modes… it can create its own wifi infrastructure network separate to any other wifi network … and indeed can use a proprietary mesh like approach to connect up the Sonos infrastructure.
Alternatively it can work with your main wifi infrastructure network.
Which should you use?
If your wifi in your house is limited and does not have good coverage where you need the a Sonos… then using the Sonos independent wifi network is good approach…
However I recommend the best approach is to use a quality main infrastructure network as a single ESSID, using cooperating wired APs or mesh (multiple path wireless link APs), and run your Sonos from that.

That will provide typically the best performance overall, and will optimally use your APs to balance load and band steer.

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20

The NDX does appear to require absolutely top notch wifi and having the ceiling between it and the router appears to be pushing its limits. Some houses have metal lined insulation between the floors, which obviously creates a bit of a barrier.
I don’t know if the web page (by entering the IP address of the NDX) shows the same info as a Muso, but if it does, have a look at it and see how the wifi connection is reported. As I mentioned, my Muso is reported on the web interface as being “marginal”.
Hard wiring with an ethernet cable, even 11 metres around the house should sort if fully.

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