The NAC52 is a MUCH more capable preamp than the NAC102, so you’d get a much fuller/wider/deeper (you choose the adjective) soundstage.
ah just got the 102/180 last week and it was such a step forward from the plain nait xs2….
okay. the 52 is a little more investment than some bigger speakers. if anyone has one to sell at a nice price, let me know
I think that you’re new to the Forum, so you may not know that Forum rules don’t allow buying or selling of equipment.
But I suggest that you have a look at some of the usual websites - Grahams HiFi (in Canonbury, London), Cymbiosis (near Leicester), or your local branch of Audio T.
Or contact James Allney of TomTom Audio (St Albans), who specialise in tracking down and selling ‘pre-loved’ Naim equipment (which they always send back to Naim for servicing before putting it up for sale).
I suggest, though, that first of all you just enjoy your newly-acquired Naim gear before setting off on (what may become) an endless upgrade path!
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It is very difficult to recommend speakers because people’s tastes in music presentation differ, and every loudspeaker sounds different. Decades ago I discovered the difference speakers make, since when I have viewed speakers as the most critical part of a system, worth spending more than anything else on to get what suits you - other things can improve and make them sound even better. (Anathema to the ‘source first’ believers.)
Your tale, though different, reminds me of my brother in law’s experience: When I first knew him he was very proud of his system, LP12 based, with Naim speakers (Allaes IIRC). Invited to listen I could only be polite, while my whole being was shouting “where’s the bass?”
He came round and listened to my system - and from that day seemed not to be proud of his system anymore. Three years later when I upgraded my speakers he grabbed at the chance to have my old ones. And when later I changed speakers again, he had my old ones again!
Of all the speakers I’ve heard, my preference has been for transmission line designs, as they do bassvery well, deep yet taut and well controlled… The downside is that they tend towards the large side and expensive to boot, as they are complex designs, difficult to design and complex to build - but the result to my ears is well worth it.
If transmission line speakers interest you then PMC are the dominant today, though Kerr Acoustics and, I think, Castle also do them. As a generalisation the higher up the ranges (and bigger the speaker) the better they are (and the more expensive they are!), though of course they have to work with your room. Some can be challenging to drive, and generally the more capable the amp the better they sound - but that is not unique to transmission lines. The most prominent manufacturer before PMC was probably IMF - makers of my first two TL speakers.
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I’m pretty sure they don’t do this. We exchanged on this before but I cannot immediately find the post. Anyway, I like them too, I bought my used CD5 from them (it hadn’t been serviced) and my new XS3, as well as organised my NAIT 3 and UnitiQute 1 service through them. But they clearly state in their used items if they have been serviced, and when. They don’t routinely send every item back to Naim. I think what they advertise as doing is giving used items a thorough check and inspection (I assume on their premises). Here’s what they actually say on their website:
All Items In Excellent Condition & Fully Tested
I have to say, if they sent every item they sell back to Naim for a service that would be a unique offering for a UK Naim dealer.
[edit, here’s the thread we discussed it before! Nap 250 - #21 by graham55]
It would be worth saying how big the room is, and what your source is. Do you already have a Napsc for the 102? If not, try to get one before doing anything else, as it makes the 102 sound more natural. Have the Hicap and 180 been serviced within the last 10 years? If not, that’s an essential thing to do.
A pair of used Naim Allaes.
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If your room is larger then you indeed likely have the wrong speakers even if you like them. You can decide how much bigger would suit in terms of sound and looks but may be try something like Graham’s LS5/9 or Spendor Classic 2/3 if in budget. They are not so difficult and would retain the golden mids (but free from the Harbeths “pretentiousness”). Don’ think you need to change electronics before you find the speakers you want.
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Thanks to all so far! The room is about 50 sqm and under the roof, 4,5m high
the napsc is already there, yes!
i will check out different speakers including dynaudio special 25 and contour, pmc, bryston, maybe old b&w 801 matrix, maybe also spendor or graham (none around near my place in augsburg/geemany)
woud be a dream to have a place for comparing great vintage speakers 
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Nice room!!)
indeed
anyone any experience with old b&w 801, will they work nicely with my nap 180 & do i have to expect low performance because of age? any age concerns on vintage speakers generally speaking?
sorry all the questions. big terrain.
From a review in zStereo (Thank you Google) ,’… and it gave a claimed sensitivity of 95dB/1w/1m with nominal impedance said to be 8 ohms. On paper, the speaker was able to produce reasonable levels of sound from a modest amplifier, but in practice needed at least 50W RMS per channel, and indeed a pretty gutsy one at that. No three-way infinite baffle enclosure (tuned to 37Hz) with a complex crossover is going to be particularly easy to drive, and the 801 didn’t rewrite this rule.’
G
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Doesn’t the 801 need a NAP 500 to get it going? A 180 won’t hack it. I rather like the suggestion of Allaes from Chris.
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i see!
never heard / saw allae anywhere around in germany so far. will keep my eyes & ears open…
Given the size of your room I really think you need a more powerful amp to fill it with sound in a convincing way. That would mean, if you want older Naim equipment, something like an 82/250. You could also consider the more powerful Classic 250.2 or 250DR now that they have been superseded by the New Classic version.
Alternatively you might find some very sensitive speakers would produce a fuller sound with your 180. Maybe Klipsch?
Where’s the spirit?! In that room he can have some DBL’s.
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What you’re seeking here is a fundamental change in the presentation of the music in the room and no amount of expensive upgrades to electronics are going to give you that fundamental shift.
I struggled on for years with Naim SBL loudspeakers trying to make them work in my room - went from 102/180, added a Hicap, Then went to a 250 which gave a little more bass but never gave the slam I was looking for. Honestly I could have put a 552/500 in that room and it still wouldn’t have given me the full bandwidth sound I craved. How do I know? Well I actually borrowed the NAC552 and even that didn’t sort the problem out! Source first is all very well if you like the presentation of the system in broad terms but it isn’t the answer to everything.
What did make me finally happy with my system was changing speakers to ATC SCM40 and I described it on this forum as the single biggest upgrade I had ever made in 35 years of audio…
Now I’m not going to recommend the SCM40 to you because I know the NAP180 isn’t man enough to drive them properly (the NAP250 is the minimum I would drive them with and I know they’re even better with the 300) Personally I would probably avoid Naim speakers like the Allae’s and SBL’s because they have a very dry bass presentation which is extremely taut and tuneful but isn’t very powerful. If you liked the sound of Dynaudio speakers why don’t you try to listen to some of them? In my experience Dynaudio are one of those speaker firms who really know their onions, but in what you describe as a big room I would be leaning towards a floorstanding model just for the larger scale.
Just my thoughts.
JonathanG
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That room is very large, and you are never going to fill it with tiny speakers. I’ll ask again; what is your source? You need to make sure everything is balanced.