I quite understand. To match the power of the Nova I’d be looking at a Supernait 2 or 3, accompanied by an ND5XS or NDX2. Hopefully you’d be able to borrow them first, as it would be a shame to change only to find that the thing you aim to fix hasn’t been.
Nova with recently arrived ProAc Tab 10 sigs here, in a room of perhaps similar size.
Purchased used and unheard, never a great idea but I knew what I wanted. This for a dining room system, to replace Spendor SA1s, which are currently being serviced and will then be used in a different location. Speaker cable is QED and standard mains cable.
Several comments from those with more experience with these speakers than myself. However in reading the thread, I noticed there is no mention of how your ProAcs were supported. IIRC HH’s pair were on stands although I don’t recall which model. Perhaps before simply changing electronics, you might consider both positioning and the speaker stands.
ProAcs were shortlisted and chosen here, because they work close to a wall. Unrealistic to use stands, I purchased the same wall brackets as Spendor supply. Majority of use is listening to background music, particularly radio. It wasn’t really even an option to change where the speaker brackets were located, so using the existing ones. For more dedicated listening this would likely be more significant.
However in setting the speakers up, the odd test track did show some slightly unattractive bass effects. Away for a few days, but if you would like to suggest a few tracks which you find unappealing I would be willing to see what occurs in my room. We do all hear music in different ways, so likely it will only be indicative. If Jennifer Warnes is your thing, try streaming the album “The Hunter” from Qobuz - it is supposed to be well recorded and one or two tracks, I have noticed reveal a few issues on Nova + ProAcs.
As an alternative to suggestions to change electronics, if you like one-box, then another option might be to consider a Spendor model which go well with Naim electronics. I have used two different pairs very satisfactorily with Nova.
Why not just get a used supernait
My ProAcs are on Solidsteel stands and a little distance from the rear wall which I feel helps with soundstage.
I tried the Jennifer Warnes - not heard it before but it sounds good, everything has good separation with nice airiness between the instruments.
I think I might get a demo of the XS3 / nd5xs2 rather than taking a punt on a used Supernait or Nait 50. I really like the ProAcs!
Have you applied the latest firmware update for the Nova?
Yes, I’m up to date and think the latest version is an improvement.
I’d agree with this as the limitations of the Nova and also believe careful speaker matching helps.
Interestingly though, I recently had to run my ND555 and LP12 through my Nova whilst my 552 was away for repair and it was immediately obvious that it is the streaming section of the Nova that was holding things back.
So, I think changing to a similar amp might not be the best option here, but a better source with the Nova, or a better source with a Supernait (which could be done in two stages).
The odd thing there is that your LP12 is presumably being digitised (and oddly running my LP12 through my Nova rekindled vinyl enthusiasm).
So the digital section itself may be pretty good, just that streaming is held back?
I compared Nova to NDX2 years ago through my active system and NDX2 was way ahead. Did it again a few years later and they were pretty close - shows how much firmware can affect the sound in my view. I wanted an NDX2 but didn’t think it would be much of an improvement without an external PSU.
Yes, that’s a good point. I also haven’t had a good music listen on the Nova since the firmware update, as it’s mostly on TV and movies duty. Though I did notice that Top Gun Maverick was sounding pretty good (and the sub really helps with that).
I also tried my 300 of the Nova, with the other sources and that was quite good.
Me exactly.
Qobuz & Internet Radio thru loudspeakers.
Cheers.
Because I’ve just sold mine, it was the fifth in twenty years… LOL. I sort of love it but find it a bit boring after a while…
You raised the same point I got comparing naim nc with the old ones. To my ears the 250dr sounded one note bass compared to the 250nc….it was an impression but I elaborated it clearly when you mentioned the same feeling
Back after a few days away @Jimmer71 so been taking a listen to the track you highlighted; more than once and on a few different systems, see below (I was moving things around so hence a few opportunities).
The album (track realistically, only skipped around) to my mind, is simply not well engineered.
The JW album I mentioned is supposed to be well recorded, if Lights of Lous… sounds good around 40 secs in, then you have a system likely performing pretty good. It’s a track others have mentioned on forum for analysing a system.
A few thoughts. Your stands - are they a model that permits adding a filler? If so, you might consider doing so, ask HH who IIRC has done something similar.
So Dawn from NG - not an album I knew, so first off Nova with S400s upstairs - first reaction the presentation is something of a muddle. Then same combo in a different room and it still felt restricted - you termed it a mess, I’d simply add perhaps very squashed.
I then tried on the ProAcs, but with shifting around, decided to try (for the first time) with NSC222 + NC250. Tried first a few other tracks inc JW and also the Pink Panther theme, to listen to how ProAcs were reacting to more oomph (than usual with a Nova). Then Dawn again - still experiencing a lack of width and height - likely again the recoding.
So just to see if my main system, full active all Naim, could make something of the track, I listened - system has recently been off, so 24 hours warm up, bit short.
Far from a revelation, it did show some depth and height, while still remaining closed in. That suggests a huge leap from Proacs / Nova necessary to deal with that specific track, to sound significantly better.
In a more general sense, Nova will be holding back the Proacs. There is a significant and worthwhile jump from Nova to NSC222 + NC250.
I’m not suggesting that is your only option, but it begins to illustrate that you may have to consider a big step up from Nova, to start to be able to enjoy a track like Dawn. No reason to change Proacs if you like them, they will shine with the right combo driving them.
The other option to s/h NC kit, would be OC NDX2 + separates. You mentioned going from Atom to Nova to provide some power for the Proacs. No experience here of Nait 50, but only very careful auditioning will determine if it is a big enough step up from Nova. IME may have to reflect on aims v budget.
(I will be putting the Nova back on Proacs in due course, so will update this post, on final listening).
Tricky track, Dawn, but nothing more useful than such a track to ascertain how to evolve a system.
Thank you @sound-hound. It’s been a few days but I now had time to listen to JW’s Lights of Louisiana and it sounds very good - plenty of separation and various instruments clearly placed across the soundstage.
It’s always been obvious that well recorded material sound good through my Nova/Tab 10 combo, it’s the occasional track album that causes some problems. Also reassuring that it took your much better than my system to make some sense of the Nubia Garcia track as it suggests my set-up is more or less ok given its position in the Naim hierarchy.
I have previously played around with speaker positioning and think they are in a good place, to my ears anyway. And my stands are 2/3 filled with atabites to answer your other question.
So I think I will maybe try some separate streamer/ amp options at home, but in slower time - I’m 95% happy and in no rush.
Thanks again for engaging and being so helpful.
J
If JW track highlighted / album, sound good, then as you suggest you likely have all “in a good place”.
I seem to remember long ago, a Yes album Close to the Edge sounded poor and I just avoided playing it. One review suggests that there is a remaster which is better than the original, time for a fresh look / listen.
Anyway pleased to be able to offer a modicum of reassurance and appreciate you updating on your thoughts.
I’m always reluctant to suggest and changes involving funds; always keen on vfm. If you really enjoy the ProAcs, then my suggestion would be, in the fullness of time, have a listen to NSC222 + NC250. Maybe worth waiting slightly longer than only going a short hop up, if you can. You could use a NAP250DR but the preamp/streamer will justify the NC250. I bought mine unheard; very pleased.
Deals will be around as initial demo units rotate and the market going forward is in the buyers favour, I hear.
Enjoy your system.
for what it is worth:
I have a Nova paired with Monitor Audio Gold, bookshelf (ribbon tweeters) and a single svs 1000pro sub. All connected with high quality cables.
The Nova is about 5yrs old with plenty of moderate volume run time. The clarity does improve with age.
I experienced similar issues with my ProAcs, big fan of the brand but maybe not a good pairing. The Gold’s ribbon tweeters, in my opinion, are the technical match for the Nova. That tech of the speaker was talked about previously and I agree.
It does take at least 30min of runtime for the Nova to warm up and should not be calibrated cold. As noted, the recording quality plays a major role since the chip is designed to translate the original recording intent to digital not interpret nor embellish.
The Golds sit on custom welded double H-section beams I fabricated with a forward angle of 15 deg to give the speaker room to breathe without giving up floor space. If you fill the cavity of the stands with sand each would weigh well over 120lbs.
Through all of the setups it became obvious that at a bare minimum a single sub is required. I am getting ready to replace the SVS with a pair of REL T9x or T7x subs, and use custom REL Blue DINs to connect.
Also bought a Nait 50 because it is worthy of legacy status.
Hi and welcome to the forum. Thanks for the exciting post about your set-up. It would also be interesting to see a photo of the system including the special stands. If you want, you can also post a first photo in the ‘System Pics’ thread(Click here), which is read by a lot of members (over 5000 posts in 2024 so far). And yes: you will definitely be pleasantly surprised by the Nait 50. Enjoy your system
Thanks Wilfried, much appreciated. Currently remodeling so will update with pics. Attached are a few pics of the stands
Thanks for the pics. That‘s really industrial style….
Enjoy your system!