Poll - New firmware: sound upgrade or downgrade?

Good written. The hf sharpness (in fine words sparkle) is problematic.
There is some kind of „loudness effect“. More hf and more bottom end. But what I lived most with naim (and was their virtue for a long time) is their slightly enhanced focus on the mids.

Sorry to hear that. Hope it will be sorted.
If not, but not ideal, will be to sell your Nd555 and buy another one without the update.

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:scream:

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Surely, all the firmware change does is reduce background noise? If someone has fiddled with tuning the system, then there is always a risk with a firmware update?

I’ve now had the chance to spend a bit more time listening to my system to try and understand what it is I don’t like about the new firmware update. And it goes something like this…

For me it all boils down to ‘less realism’ at higher volume levels!

One of the great strengths of a big Naim system is it’s ability to play music at natural and realistic volume levels. Much like you’d find if you went out and listened to a live band down at your local pub. Even big orchestral pieces can sound strikingly real if you get the volume right. The accurate portrayal of the true dynamics of an instrument is essential to get that ‘live’ feel of real music and, up until the FW update, on my system, I was achieving this pretty much every night on every track I played. However, there is a downside to this and for me it was that music could sound slightly ‘less’ natural at lower volume levels, especially with DBL’s the high and low frequencies could sound a little curtailed. Similar in some respects to the problems plagued by the cheaper Japanese amps where they gave you a loudness button to boost the high and low frequencies at low volumes to overcome this problem. As a Naim system doesn’t have this ability you live with (and understand) this slight weakness, knowing that when the volume goes up it will magically transport you to the venue.

With the new firmware update I’m finding that playing music at lower levels is in fact much better and without doubt sounds more real. I can imagine that the vast majority of Naim owners probably have neighbours and are unable to exploit the the volume levels I can play at as my nearest neighbour is a car ride away! For them, I’m sure, this represents a massive improvement at lower volume levels and represents a real improvement in musical clarity.

Now, the obvious down-side to this is that when the volume goes up everything just gets ‘less real’ as the top-end begins to bite too soon and you end up with this fizzy, tinkly and quite hot treble that just sounds plainly ‘un-real’. The effect of the increased bass now becomes too prevalent almost driving the bass into distortion. Sure, you hear oodles more bass but the accuracy is now very very poor. Drums no longer sound like skins being hit and more like something electronic is playing them, they certainly no longer start and stop like they did.

There is a further downside to this poor high volume performance issue and that’s he loss of venue acoustics. This is the reverberation of the instruments within the venue when recorded. This seems to localise images and instrument placement and was so good with the old firmware it was sometimes frightening. My system has now completely lost this ability, which is why I feel it sounds a lot more ‘hi-fi’ sounding and much less natural. Big system owners will know that we all live on a tight-rope at the very edge of musical realism where the direction of a simple fuse is a ‘real’ meaningful thing. It doesn’t take much to knock us off but for me that’s exactly what the new FW update has done and why the pole probably shows 70+% of Naim owners enjoying it and (us) the big system owners finding it much more of a struggle.

Just to reiterate my belief; the new FW brings much more realism at lower volume levels and much less realism at high volume levels. Does YMV?

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Totally silly… but thought about it. Before doing that I need to have some further talk to naim. :blush:

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Spot on!

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That is your ears! (Google Fletcher Munson)
So in your system it’s like “loudness” compensation, but not turnigh off at higher sound levels.

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Pretty much, yes! It’s the same or similar effect of not having the ability to switch the loudness button off, so as the volume goes up there is no longer a natural alignment of treble, midrange and bass. The treble and bass simply become too dominant and overpower the midrange. This is perhaps further supported by comments that a lot have mentioned about things sounding louder at a lower volume levels. My DBL’s use to be more or less flat out at volumes between 9:30 and 10:00 on the volume dial. I can’t get near these volume settings any more. Anything over 9:00 o’clock now just sound too loud and uncomfortable.

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8:00 o’clock is the new 9:00 o’clock for me!

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Why not? If he can sell it and buy another one less expensive, he can eventually earn some profit.
For now he is very disappointed and there’s no solution to go back. What do you suggest Nigel? Inject inside a kind of positive virus? :joy:

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I think you have hit the nail on the head! I’m loving the new update, but yes I have neighbours and speakers / room that sound best at moderate levels, it is working for me at a slightly lower volume than before……

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Not entirely true, unless specifically stated that there is no vulnerability update, software updates can contain cyber vulnerability updates, and under UK legislation Naim is required to offer that vulnerability support, and if your network is connected to the internet you would be foolish not to apply the update.
I believe there was a detailed thread on this a few months back.

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Thank you for the detailed explanation. As I don’t listen above 70db you’ve persuaded me I do need to apply the update. Hoping that it will bring the point where the system sounds a bit dead at low volumes, to a lower volume (evenings when my child is falling asleep).

100% undoubtedly an improvement for me here on my NDX 2. Graphics, interface, sound quality, the whole shebang.

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If I were the only one with the problem - like a „personal problem“ this could be a solution.
But this definitely is not the case!
And exchanging nd555 is not that easy. 1. finding a young one like mine (2022 build). 2. Finding one with old fw! Fw is too easy to install.
3. selling mine …
And when so desperate to do - naim should/would offer help.

And now… @Blackbird … a powerswitch d2 came available… but with the system being out of nd555 balance I will not go this demo route. All dullness (naca5, PN, ground to floating :blush:) is sadly welcome these days.

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When the first tone came after the update I instantly thougt that it is like loudness.
And I fully agree that before the system was a bit laid back at lower levels and now this is gone. Night time levels are good.
But theses are very moderate volume levels. When it comes to slightly more volume the SQ overruns itself with too much top and bottom end.

As long as I have owned naim it always sounded better at a medium (for me it is loud) volume level that at low volume levels. Low volume level listening was getting better and better climbing up the product ladder.
I am fully convinced that naim has heared this as well by now.

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Update. On my system where I have for about 5years run a pair of REL subs alongside my stand mounts. Today I was able to turn them off…… as there was too much bass with them on.
System 222/300/NC250, Atohm GT1 speakers, Vertere redline cables.

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Hi Brendan, did you notice an emphasis on treble as well?

Not yet. Playing dead can dance live, which is quite dynamic and well recorded. Treble is crisp and defined with detailed transients and a very open sound which is consistent with my Vertere redline XLR and speaker cables (in contrast to standard Naim). That hasn’t changed, but you might find my system not to your taste anyway! I like detail and cymbals that sound ‘tic’ not ‘tissssh’…. It’s all very subjective isn’t it. I suspect if you listen for a week or two you might get used to the change?… brain is a funny thing.

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