I’ve done something slightly different:
I have a UPS to power & safeguard my NAS.
In addition as it has 2 outlets that are powered through its internal 1:1 isolation transformer, C&D mode filters & other noise suppression components,
I have one outlet to the SMPS for the NAS as would normally be used, the other spare UPS outlet I have to a power strip that the SMPS’s for ethernet switch, broadband & phone are connected.
This should give a fair amount of noise isolation from the SMPS’s, plus I have all the AC & DC cables loaded with specific ferrite mixes to further suppress the SMPS switching noise band. And yes it’s measurable on a ‘scope & subjectively improves SQ.
Added bonus is in the event of a power cut, the UPS continues to supply the phone & broadband for about half an hour giving time to save any ongoing computer work & end phone calls.
It all depends on the load on the network and the quality of the router. If many people use the router in parallel, then actually the packet queuing can bring the improvement of SQ, or at least ensure better streamer work comfort. However, if we only use the router when listening to music, this effect on SQ should be rather marginal (if the router speed is suitable for the quality of files).
I just wanted to write that it is probably easier to provide a good SQ with WiFi than from a cable connection.
We can listen to music from the following sources:
- USB (SSD / HDD / PENDRIVE) - may result in noise from disk electronics or USB power supply
- Ethernet - may result in noise from network devices (perhaps support for PoE, etc.), weak cables, distances, etc.
- WiFi - risk is poor, unstable speed (nowadays it should not be a problem), on the other hand, if the WiFi network card in Naim is well designed, this should not affect the SQ.
So trusting Naim and choosing WiFi, we do not have to worry about choosing the right disks, network devices, or appropriate power conditioners for these devices. I understand that fun with them is pleasant from the founding itself. However, if SQ is the most important thing, buying better “analog” cables for audio equipment, instead of buying audiophilic Ethernet cables, at least for the majority should give more improvement.
Hi, I agree with much of your reasoning, but the above made no sense to me… what queuing interface are you referring to?
I think we were referring to wifi… wifi effectively uses a collision avoidance mechanism, and so quite quickly can get inefficient under heavy load. The WMM method ensures as the SSID becomes more loaded, the radio slices more regular transmit time slots for higher priority data. This is often specifically used for media applications where there is low latency requirements.
On the first gen streamers I established there was a preference to the resultant audio on more equally spaced Ethernet frames. By extension that could be the same for wifi, although I never undertook such evaluations myself with wifi.
Yes you are right. I’m sorry, I used a simplification. When writing about queue I meant WMM, which you gave as an example and which I associate as QoS for WiFi. When I think about QoS I immediately think how it works - hence the simplification and word “queue”.
Power conditioner suck the life out of any music . Pug your system in without your line conditioner and listen to it for a few days then go back. You will
Notice it makes everything mush. In simple words
they kill the music hope this helps may not be what
You want to here but it’s the truth
Happy listening
Hi Larivee-5
Did your experience of using line conditioner apply to your analogue parts like streamers or just the NAS/router…part which had a -ve SQ?
Ken
I know it’s not directed specifically at me, but there’s been a decades-long belief that Naim gear—especially power amps, but it seems sources, too—and PCs don’t do well together. I’m not certain that is true in every case. Plenty of people are completely happy with Furman balanced units and especially AudioQuest Niagara just to name a couple (power conditioning a part of what they attempt to achieve). I don’t use them simply because I feel most do more harm than good SQ-wise; they just seem to make music sound closed-in and odd. Tough to describe.
That said, NAS, router, switch, etc., I feel, is a different matter. Network/streaming gear (physical Naim streamer notwithstanding), IME, benefits to some conditioning/noise suppression. I’ve used PowerVar (conditioning/transformer) and now Topaz ITs on these parts of the chain to great effect. Not so sure I’d place them in the same room on the same gear, though.
Anyway, my point is not all power conditioning is equal; and not all is negative when paired with Naim.
I have also considered a mains filter conditioner distribution block such as iso tek, Russ Andrews or Supra for router NAS and switch. Most of these have surge protection built in which are often frowned upon when used on the same circuit as hifi. However I have my system on a dedicated supply and the router, NAS on the main house circuit. Would such a distribution block with surge protection have any detrimental effects. I would guess not as on separate circuit but in the same room albeit 5 metres away.
I have all of my networking gear (modem, Cisco 2960, NUC for Roon, opticaModule) plugged into a Supra power strip sans surge protector - they might be discontinued though, at least the US model. In order to deal with surge protection and conditioning I added two iFi AC iPurifier’s to the strip. The Supra strip itself seemed to tighten up the sound some and the iFi’s seemed to remove a bit of top level hash. All subtle but worth it and good to know that the gear has surge protection. Plugged into a separate circuit and in a different room/floor from the hifi (actually directly below it). I also have lots of other computers, hard drive banks, printers etc on that circuit as it’s the office, so it definitely warranted some conditioning. The Naim gear goes into dedicated 20amp circuits either direct to the wall (amp) or into a Wiremold strip (V1), also with an iFi AC iPurifier. Great little things as you can move them around, and don’t get stuck with an overly expensive and possibly underused power strip.
I just purchased a iFi power station and plug my Core, Switch, NAS, Router, Modem (with ifi power transformer 12V2A), now the NDS sound with much quieter background, but sill need to try A/B compare if that is actually better or just diff.
The ipurifier looks like an interesting product. Could work well with something like a wireworld matrix to keep things simple and at a reasonable cost.
I’m glad you shared this as I’m ordering up a Furman F-1000 UPS and was wondering if I could use it for other devices. Perhaps NAS in the critical load and a strip with router, switch (cisco 2960), modem, TV, Apple TV in the non-critical load.
Hi ElMafko, my only objective was to have some isolation / suppression from the potential switching noise from my audio SMPS’s. The addition of specific ferrite has improved that further.
The phone & broadband supply was an afterthought, but it has turned out to be a useful feature in the rare power outage event.
I use an UPS for broadband router, PoE power source switch and NAS… it works well, and have about 30 mins power when interrupted. Although our powersupply in our village has massively improved in recent years with the new overhead wiring having been installed through the village, outages still occur from time to time, and also it provides isolation when I switch off the electricity for maintenance / wiring work.
Thanks @Mike-B and @Simon-in-Suffolk. I currently keep my broadband modem, amplifi HD router, and cisco poe source switch on a wiremold power strip so I can pull the one plug when I want to do a power reset which I generally do once a month as a practice. So I may just plug the strip into the UPS rather than plugging all in separately.
I just got the Furman F1000 delivered. I think this thing is heavier than my 250!
As for placement, is it okay if it’s on the same rack as my NAS? I’ll have to do some reorganizing to place it elsewhere at the moment.
Guys get rid of your power conditioners and listen to your kit with out them . Them go back. I think
you will actually ( hear) a lot more information all
they do is make everything mush. A recording engineer had a line conditioner transformer I told
Him to get rid of it. His comment thanks the music
came back
Thank you your correct they do more to turn
the music to mush. Find out unplug them then
go back. You will find out they hurt the sound
not help it. It’s a pleasure to read that I am not
the only one who hates them. I have a Linn a
Crimson 710 the new 649E4s and a pair of Tocaro
42s . A friend brought over his Furnam transformer
Line conditioner. All it did was destroy the music
in simple terms it took away the life of the music.
Even he agreed and he’s not one to give in. There
horrible. Thanks again
Good choice try it with and without but don’t be
surprised if you find out it just destroys the sound.
They don’t help but they do turn your music to mush.
I’m wondering what units you’ve tried in your system, to make such a blanket claim?
Several folks here are using the Audioquest Niagara products and report very positive improvements.