Roon Endpoint (transport only) – Cost No Object – options?

Streaming Audio
83

The problem is that most transport are also Servers, or Streamers with Dac.
I feel the Lumin is probably the best solution. DCS is more specific to DCS dacs, at least if someone wants to connect a top very expensive dac.
Sonore doesn’t suit Thomas.
Maybe Emm labs Ns1?

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Using UPnP/DLNA media streaming standards, the NS1 Streamer is able to share media, and communicate between many different media devices. Using its app, it can easily be remote controlled by mobile and tablet devices.

Along with UPnP/DLNA support, the NS1 is also ROON READY and is a ROON ENDPOINT.

The NS1 can connect to many high resolution streaming services like TIDAL and QOBUZ. It also supports popular streaming services like SPOTIFY, DEEZER, vTUNER and many more.

The NS1 supports network and USB file playback including AAC, AIFF, ALAC, FLAC, MP3, WAV and WMA, along with MQA® and DSD (DFF, DSF) files.

84

That one looked interesting but it’s mainly a DSP, and being a streamer is just an extension of its main purpose.

Pity, Weiss is a nice little Swiss company.

Unfortunately, it seems there aren’t a lot of “transport only” options on the market.

In terms of performance it’s a mistake, in my opinion.

Using a server as a transport is a huge compromise.

The Roon Core, or a DNLA server, are computing hungry. They need an actual computer to run them. And the more powerful the computer is, the better.

So connecting those devises to a DAC is… nonsense, IMO.

Of course, some of those very expensive servers are pretty “silent”. Which is even more absurd because we pay to have a “silent” server (a computer/server is noisy by nature). It’s like asking a fish to fly…

Splitting the server and the streamer makes total sense, in my opinion.

The server stays somewhere on the network, away from the audio gear.

The streamer, which needs a LOT LESS computing power, is silent and optimised to be connected to a DAC (which is a very sensible piece of gear).

Apparently, most audiophiles don’t like the idea of having the server and streamer splitted and prefer the convenience of one box only.

But the idea of paying a computer 20K only to “try” to make it silent isn’t appealing…

So the options remain :

  • dCS Network Bridge.
  • Sonore Signature Rendu Optical SE
  • Lumin U1

Pity dCS doesn’t make evolve their Network Bridge. A well designed optical interface, like on the Sonore, would certainly be a nice addition.

1 Like
85

Sounds like it comes down to if you want silver: Lumin or DCS, black: Sonore. Optical: Sonore vs Lumin.

Personally I would go for the Sonore and an accompanying opticaModule or etherRegen.

86

Colour, really :sweat_smile:

The idea here the have the quietest possible streamer.
Which, for once, is a very much measurable thing.

All we need is a little box capable to transmit an LPCM stream without transmitting noise.

Unfortunately, no one will publish those measurements.
So the only way, and not my favourite one, is the listen to them all.

Which won’t happen.

If found a comment from a guy, on another forum, that did actually compare the Sonore and the Lumin. He very much preferred the Sonore.

The problem is the “preferred”. We all like different things. He obviously couldn’t tell which of the two was the quietest ; he nevertheless believes the Sonore provides a “blacker background” which could be understood as lesser noise.

1 Like
87

I would too.

Sonore’s optical interface does a great job at isolating the streamer from the network.

But the thing is ridiculously expensive.

3k for the ugly box and the power supply is a lot money.

Remember, the Sonore Signature Rendu Optical SE and the Optical Rendu share the exact same board…

1 Like
88

You know I was being cheeky…

But I swear by Sonore products, their company, and service. Running a pair of opticalModules into an opticalrendu powered by their Sonore Power Supply which probably gets me close to a Signature but not quite. Haven’t heard Lumin or dCS. I did recently get a little Matrix Mini-i Pro 3 for the office to replace an aging UQ1. It has Roon streaming built in, though on a lark I decided tottery my microRendu 1.4 I was going to sell into the USB of it, and oh boy, just that much better. Sonore makes good stuff, at all price levels.

1 Like
89

I hadn’t realised that, good to know.

I was about to get a ISO Regen but at the same time was thinking whether to upgrade the power supply to the Roon Rock NUC. But, as you pointed out the other day, it didn’t make much of a difference when the NUC was a server only and connected to the network rather than directly to the DAC. So, I had to make a choice, network or direct.

After a call or two with Audiostore (Vortexbox), I decided not to go for the ISO Regen but the OpticalRendu instead. Especially as I already had a Cisco switch that would accept an optical connection. Today I’ve been busy making up some nice Starquad DC cables in preparation for it turning up tomorrow!

1 Like
90

Hi Thomas
I can’t help wondering why you are married to Roon? I have never used it myself, but have read plenty about it since it’s release. Nick Bacon (Fourlegs on here) has posted on other forums that he feels Roon degrades the sound, and he uses a different software now with better (sound) results. Not sure which one, but I can look it up.
He has an Innous Statement as a server/streamer, also he just added an Antipodes K 50, which I have not heard from him about. I believe there are a few guys on audiophile style forum that found the same, and abandoned Roon for sound quality reasons, my guess is all the processing needed to run it bogs it down somehow, but that is only a guess. He uses a pimped out Mscaler and Dave as a Dac, with added linear power supplies on both, Sean Jacobs makes the power supplies, DC4 is the one.

1 Like
91

Using the Innuos there is absolutely no doubt that Roon degrades the sq compared to the internal player. In experimental mode the gap is far closer and you get the benefits of Roon too. I’m not sure anyone is getting Roon because it improves sq

92

That’s a good reason for sticking Roon on a dedicated Core device and do the heavy lifting there. Roon recommends keeping Core and Endpoints separated for best performance rather than trying to do it all on one device.

93

Hi @NO-QUARTER ,

Yes, for me Roon is the ultimate music manager. I love it! :star_struck: :star_struck: :star_struck:

I tried so many…

So why do I like it?
Well, not for the information it provides. I don’t read it.
So why then? Classical music…

It tags everything automatically and creates links between the same compositions.

Your second point is rather interesting : Roon degrades sound.

Well, it doesn’t.

But…

There is one thing both users or product designers do not do : they don’t read documentation.

The first rule of Roon is : you will NOT connect the Roon Core (the server) to your DAC.

So, if your Roon Core runs in a nice and very expensive Innuos Statement and you connect that Innuos Statement to your DAC, then yes it will sound awfull.

Apparently Innuos does not read manuals… (I’m being cheeky , the Innuos can also run as a Roon Endpoint only)

This is because we should not connect a Roon Core to a DAC.

It is that simple.

EDIT :

I’m somewhat fooling around about this “first rule of Roon”.

The fact is whatever server we use it will be power hungry.
And the Roon Core is probably the most power hungry of them all.
Connecting a power hungry device to a DAC, never is a good idea.

I admit it is convenient. But it’s compromise.

Aurender makes very nice servers, dead quiet, and a few other companies too.
Aurender does not offer to run Roon Core on their servers, and probably never will. As Roon is so power hungry, it would compromise the isolation the Aurender servers provide.

3 Likes
94

If you connect your Innuos to your DAC then yes, using Roon will result in bad sound.

But, as explained on Roon’s manual, you should not connect the Roon Core to your DAC.

95

That suggests that you’re not sure.

96

If it’s cost no object, why are you quibbling about VFM? :grinning:

3 Likes
97

I’m OK paying a certain amount for some nice audio gear, but not for an ugly case :joy:

98

The dCS NB has a nice plain case, a nice tiny little blue light, and will send a nice bland data stream to a dac.

It’s nice and nothing-y. :neutral_face:

(Talking of VFM, it has doubled in price since I bought and sold one a couple of years ago).

2 Likes
99

Is the Soulution 590 USB converter a server??

100

Sorry, I don’t know. Perhaps checking their website could help :wink:

101

Denafrips Gaia D2D to feed a clean USB signal to a dac:

102

It works perfectly well connected to my DAC via experimental mode. I also have a core separate to my Innuos and using that also degrades the sound

1 Like