Sorry mine was a question rather than a statement
Sorry… well I don’t know because I have not seen any measures of mains noise or efficiency, or any white paper… but if there is I will gladly pass my subjective assessment.
BTW I have bought his power supplies before, and I can’t remember them being anything special, but that was many years ago.
MMky,
On question a I believe it’s possible to find a power supply that improve on the included with my NUC10i5-ROCK. This based on an experiment using a linear lab dc-cube, to my ears this opened up the sound considerably compared to the supplied ps. So I’m optimistic to find an improvement in this area!
I also tried the a dc-cube on my EE switch to god effect, so when I found a Swedish reseller of power supplies with audio ambitions I decided to try a Farad Super3 on the switch with the intention to also add a 19v version for the NUC if that was positive. But unfortunately I did not like what the Farad did to the switch so the ps was returned. If a 19V version would work I of cause can’t tell… but will try another option, Keces P8, as next step.
I had intended to build my own NUC but I’m a MAC user and didn’t want to dig up a Windows display and keyboard to install the software nor did I want to worry about having to install updates to Windows so I bought the i3 version of the Roon Nucleus.
The i3 is $1K cheaper than the Plus version and I seriously doubt most users need the Plus.
The Nucleus is sitting about two feet from my equipment rack. It’s directly connected with an Ethernet cable to an EE 8Switch. I’m powering both the Nucleus and the EE 8Switch with an Uptone JS-2 power supply. UPtone make the highly popular EtherRegen switch.
The JS-2 is a Dual-output, choke-filtered linear power supply with four user-selectable DC output voltages. It comes with one power cable. I bought a second one with an adaptor for the EE 8Switch.
I cannot say how much difference the JS-2 makes but I can say the addition of the Nucleus made a significant difference to the various computer based Roon Cores I tried.
Hi
I have seen that JS-2 get good feedback but unfortunately if I’m correct informed 10th generation nucs require 19V vs. older generations that are OK with 12-19V, so not an option for me. If you find the time to experiment by swapping to the original ps for a test, please let us know how they compare.
On a side note, I believe your assessment that an i3 is enough for most Roon users is correct.
My i5 seem to run at a low load, consuming like 5-7W total, and cpu is rated at 25W.
Ps.
For your info no windows is involved in setting up a nuc with Roon/Rock. All you need is a usb keyboard, a screen (I used a tv with hdmi) and a usb stick for the installation.
I have to assume you mean from an operational standpoint ie speed and responsiveness of the ROON user interface? If this is the case can you expand further on this? I have been running ROON on my iMac for at least 5 or more years and have frequently thought about changing.
There should be no difference in sound quality according to the people at ROON
Best
Gregg
I wouldn’t pay for the Roon Nucleus+ myself as it’s Intel NUC MB / inners sat in a nice case. The Roon Nucleus White paper confirms they take the inners of an Intel NUC and place it inside their own designed case.
There’s a header " PLATFORM: THE INTEL NUC".
Basically, by taking the inners from an Intel NUC it means they can keep the tech up to date without the cost of designing it themselves. This effectively leaves them free to focus on the Roon Rock Platform.
I’ve been running a Roon NUC in an Akasa Fanless case for a while now and it has been excellent at a fraction of the cost. Wasn’t that hard to swap the inners from one to the other and pop in some ram / PCIe & SSD hard drives. Certainly worth considering if your ok with building computers etc. Roon provide plenty of instructions as well… which is really good of them to be fair.
I do have a question though about LPS for the NUC.
At the moment I use an iFi Mercury USB3 directly from the NUC into the MScaler. The usb cable goes into an iFi USB Purifier 3 (USB3) which is plugged into the MScaler. The usb power doesn’t come from the NUC though.
I have a 10cm splitter from the NUC. One side, USB3 with no power data only, goes to the NUC and the other side (USB2) goes into a Power Bank. The two combine and join the iFi Mercury cable. Now, would it still be worth while adding a LPS to the NUC or, does the fact the power for the USB comes from a power bank mean it’s not worth it?
The Roon Nucleus will work with 12 to 19 volts. The JS-2 works perfectly with the Roon Nucleus.
I had intended to built my own NUC. It would have saved me about $1K or so. However, when I found out that I’d need to jerry rig a keyboard/display and that I might have to install Windows updates later on, I chose to go with the Roon Nucleus. I’m glad I did. It’s plug and play and in my current situation that’s what I needed.
I just used my Mac keyboard and an old mouse while installing Roon Rock OS. I wouldn’t use Microsoft windows on a NUC to run Roon. Roon Rock OS is all that is needed. Once installed you detach all keywords etc and it keeps itself up-to-date… just like the official Roon Nucleus does.
I had been running Roon Core on my iMac. For whatever reason, when I installed the Roon Nucleus I noticed an improve sound [quote=“glevethan, post:26, topic:13511, full:true”]
I have to assume you mean from an operational standpoint ie speed and responsiveness of the ROON user interface? If this is the case can you expand further on this? I have been running ROON on my iMac for at least 5 or more years and have frequently thought about changing.
There should be no difference in sound quality according to the people at ROON
Best
Gregg
[/quote]
I had been running my Roon core on my iMac. After installing the Roon Nucleus, I feel there is an improved sound quality. This could be because the Roon Nucleus is connected directly to the EE 8Switch but also because computers are inherently noisy.
Yes you are correct, Nucleus is based on an earlier generation “NUC”. My point was that apparently the 10th gen. NUCs don’t work with less than 19V.
I use an Uptone JS-2 to power both my EE 8Switch and Roon Nucleus. The only negative is cost. Otherwise, I doubt you’ll find a better solution for powering your EE + NUC.
I agree with what you have posted in that the Nucleus is nothing else but an Intel NUC inside a fanless case. Actually I would disagree with the statement I quoted above. The Nucleus + (and Nucleus) both use an Intel NUC 8. We are now up to NUC 10 with NUC 11 around the corner. So actually old technology going on 3 generations old which Roon has yet to update. On an additional side note several have complained about a whining coil noise emanating from the NUC 8 series.
Danny from Roon does not deny the fact that the Nucleus is a NUC. His only comments are that it runs a custom version of ROON OS dedicated strictly to the Nucleus which results in an approximately 30% operational performance gain compared to a DIY NUC running Roon Rock OS. Performance strictly derived from the stripped down Roon OS and not due to hardware.
With that said he has been highly complimentary of the new Apple Mac Mini w/ M1 chip and is extremely impressed with its performance. I have been contemplating going in that direction if I choose to move my Roon Core installation off of my iMac. It will not be easy to get me motivated as it has been working flawlessly for the past 5-6 years.
I am in the process of finishing my second system with a recently restored Nait 2 from AV Options and I have a Chord Qutest inbound. I have considered employing the new Mac mini as an endpoint. Yes - it is a “noisy” computer - however those connecting their DAC’s directly to a Nucleus sometimes don’t realize this is exactly what a Nucleus is - a noisy (NUC) Computer as well.
For now I will start with an iPad running as a Roon endpoint connected to the Qutest. After that I will investigate the Rendu’s, BlueSound Node 2i (primarily because it outputs optical), and finally perhaps a Mac mini. For now I am not concerned with USB into the Qutest. Its USB input (as different from the Hugo2 and possibly I believe the TT2), is galvanically isolated. I had the chance to speak with Rob Watts at last years NY CanJam and he said not to make a big deal over how his DAC’s are fed as they are all designed to be “agnostic” to the method of feeding them. He actually ended our conversation by saying something to the effect of “just go home and plug an iPad into it”.
Best
Gregg
PS perhaps the long winded post above was another way of saying the only reason I have to deviate from my current Roon/iMac combination is if I could see faster “operational” service from my iPad’s and iPhones controlling Roon. And if anyone asks - no it is not my network or ancillary equipment. My network is highly robust with 1 gigabit Fiber Optic coming into the house and multiple Cisco 2960 Routers acting as switches for the entire network and 4 Google Nest Routers throughout the house - not employed in a Mesh configuration but rather ethernet cabled directly back to the main Google Nest Router.
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I added an Uptone JS-2 PS to my system that can power both the Roon Nucleus and EE 8Switch. I’m not using USB but I still feel that the LPS is worthwhile. I admit I didn’t compare things individually between the Nucleus and EE 8Switch but overall there is a lower noise floor and a perceived improvement in sound quality.
The cost of the JS-2 is a consideration but otherwise, it’s probably among the best available for the application.
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Cheers, I can see at some point I may give one a try… or, something like the Meridian 210 streamer which is quite compact and will detach the Roon NUC from the MScaler. Given that there was little to no drop in SQ going from G1 - Roon NUC after my USB changes, it’s probably lower down the scale at the mo.
Have been running ROCK on a NUC5i3 since it was launched, so a few years now. I run a number of zones with a library of some 90K tracks on a NAS based library.
I have also benchmarked this 2015 NUC with multiple zones playing upsampled content with DSP filters (that’s all zones with extensive EQ DSP and upsampling/downsampling) without issue.
Just make sure you have upto 8GB RAM but no more is needed until your library is more than 250k tracks.
This is a misconception. Roon provides a dedicated server that you install on the NUC. It is Roon ROCK and no Windows is involved. It is essentially the very same system as what runs on the Nucleus, the difference being only that on the Nucleus they know the hardware exactly and can do finer temperature control. But frankly this does not matter at all with a decent NUC. You set it up (needs a keyboard and e.g. HDMI TV), which takes all of a few minutes, then it takes care of itself just like a Nucleus and you remove the screen and keyboard. Administration is then the same as with Nucleus, i.e. mostly via the Roon app. Roon publishes a list of NUC models that are fully supported by them.
Of course, the convenience of a Nucleus is worth something, and it is fine as it is. The difference is just that for the price of the basic Nucleus you can get a much better spec’ed machine. I got a NUC in a fanless (like the Nucleus) case with 250 GB SDD for Roon, 4 TB SSD for audio files, an Intel i5 with 16 GB RAM, all for the price of the basic Nucleus.
I got it from cirrus7, the “nimbini media edition”, all set up and the Roon software installed, plug it in and off you go. Pictures at this link: “What was the last bit of gear you bought?”
About the Roon software:
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I would LOVE to get a Cirrus. The problem is I have attempted several times (I am in the States) and Felix does not reply to emails, once I speak to him on the phone and he promises a follow up he never does etc.
I think he simply does not want to sell to the States.
Best
Gregg
I see, this is unfortunate. I mean, I might get it with customs being involved and all, and maybe he has enough work to do with EU sales anyway, but then he could simply say so. I had a fine experience with him, but I am in Germany. It’s a mighty fine machine too, zero problems, the BIOS was up to date, etc. So much so that I felt compelled to email him after a month, just to tell him how happy I am.
Feeling so bad for you that I am inclined to say that I want to help, but I don’t know what the forum rules are for this so I have not said anything.