I’m just floating this idea as a new topic for forum discussion and participation. Obviously i’m just running it by Richard The Leader first to see if it infringes any forum rules first before I post anything.
Basically whenever one of us Naim forum members comes across any secondhand or pre loved either specifically Naim equipment or more widely to include any HiFi equipment we think may be a scam we post a warning to other members.
If Richard or other forum members can give there input first before we kick things off.
I would just like to add that I have come across a lot of scams in my search for equipment online and the scammer’s do particularly like to focus on Naim as it’s a well regarded high value item.
I have in the past always made the online retailer/auction site aware of the offending item.
Just my ha’pennyworth but the problem with this is that there is unlikely to be any way of confidently determining if something is a scam or not. If a legitimate item is flagged wrongly this could be source of a grievance towards the forum - and by extension Naim. If individual members wish to post they can do so and Richard can moderate as he deems fit.
I would advise some caution here - mainly because it’s too easy to come up against forum rules, specifically referring to any sales site or any item in particular that may be for sale. The idea, good though not may seem, rather falls down right there.
Furthermore, unless you have actually been scammed, how do you know for certain it is a scam? Naim wouldn’t want this forum to be host to calling someone a scammer when they turn out to be perfectly legitimate.
There are some scams out there and it is up to us to be vigilant when buying. My Spidey sense has been triggered a few times this year as I seek to upgrade my entire Olive system, and I may have missed a few sought after items which were genuine. However I have my money and do not have any dodgy items. Upgrading going well so far.
Now, if we start posting here about what we think might be a scam and it is in fact a genuine article being sold by a completely respectable person, and we cause the loss of a sale and/or defame the said person, we put ourselves and possibly the owners of this forum at risk of being sued. We are after all a litigious society now.
I like the idea of a warning system against scammers, but not sure here is the right place.
I’ll just use a loose explanation of why I thought that something in the past was a scam and this may help people to determine the scam rather than just pointing current scams out.
For instance about a year ago there was a scammer on a well known auction website who was trying to sell Naim Sl2’s. Fortunately during a site wide search I noticed that there was several Naim Sl2’s for sale in different countries all using the same images and description.
I also noticed they used to post the items for sale on the weekend perhaps because they thought there would be less security staff/people checking fraudulent listings on a weekend.
The Sl2’s kept popping up for months but I haven’t seen the scam Sl2’s for a long time now so hopefully they have given up.
Most useful might be tips on how to identify a scam - and, though with obvious sadness, real-life experiences as to how to avoid.
Somehow someone offering a complete Statement system with speakers to match, plus $10M money to spend on music because you are such a kind and worthy person in need of rewarding, merely asking you to give them free access to your bank account to make the transfer and verify your address for delivery, might be considered as a potential scam - but the real risk is the ones that are plausible.
I would agree with Richard and all the other member’s who have already posted that we can’t post about anything we may think or perceive is a scam as we can’t categorically prove it.
But we can explain the tricks that scammers use and maybe build a better picture of how to say safe and look after our hard earned money.
These scams were getting very bad about a year ago but the problem seems to have become a lot better and safer recently but they do still exist as I’ve come across a few recently so we should all be wary when buying equipment.
We could compile a list of Scams - What to look out for and warning signs.
Item listed is far cheaper than it should realistically be. (If the price is too good to be true)
Seller requests that the transaction is taken off site.
Item is listed in the UK but after corresponding with the seller the item is in fact outside the UK.
A pastime of mine is watch dealing and the two biggest signals for me are to meet anywhere apart from the sellers home address and cash ONLY. I walk away from these whatever the circumstances, there is always another watch to buy…
If you are buying from a site such as eBay, then if you pay by Paypal you have a fairly high degree of protection as a buyer. However, it’s still worth being cautious, and if things don’t seem quite right, trust your instincts.
