Speakers for acoustic bass

Locked and loaded into Roon and about to play it!

Just try to hear a P8 against your deck. It all makes a difference - the platter, the bearing, the plinth, the motor, the power supply. It all starts with the deck, then the arm, then the cartridge.

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I’m not 100 per cent sure on the cable I have. I think I didn’t get the naim ones in the end bit did get them at 3.5 metres. I haven’t been able to tell what they are by looking at them either. The guy at the store said naim recommend their own cables but that these other ones will be pretty much equivalent. This guy has been selling naim for some years and owns naim gear himself. He did insist on the naim interconnects though.

It’s all down to vibration, the bearing creates rumble, the power supply can introduce all sorts of noise, the better the engineering in all these components are the more information the cartridge can extract and send to the amp, as is most of the detail may be hidden behind a wall of noise that you never actually hear until it’s gone.

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Try and find out what they are, the wrong cables may damage your amp but yours may be fine of course but the right cables sound so much better, you will get more bass through with them

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I have pmc 20.23 and their bass reproduction is very good imho, I think quite a few on this forum have posted positive reviews on them, they are relative small, you should be able to pick a used pair at a good price, However I think the latest version 25.23i is expensive should you want to buy new.

If you want a 30Hz note (which is well below the standard lowest double bass note at 41Hz right?) that sounds realistic and tight, that is a big ask of any system. You need:
1 a good source note = top flight deck
2 a good amp (tick this box)
3 good speakers
4 a good room (a real rabbit hole this one. Suffice to say a boxy room and/or hard surfaces can really mess with bass.)

I’m interested in why a more expensive turntable with a relatively cheap cartridge might be better

You’d think the spinning platter is simple and the same across all say Rega tables. But it’s not, it minimises noise and vibration and you get what you pay for. The arm bearings minimize loss of movement by the stylus. The cartridge captures that movement. The phono stage amplifies it. But if the spinning platter is noisy, you can’t remove that with an expensive cartridge or arm or anything.

Also, a relatively low cost deck, since it won’t be as well isolated from external vibration, risks picking up the speaker vibrations. A sub could be pounding out 30Hz which then gets picked up by the record player. It risks sounding flabby and unrealistic.

All that said, you’d certainly hear a 30Hz note. The game is choosing how close you want it to sound to the real thing.

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Not everyone subscribes to that mantra. Any chain is as weak as its weakest link, and that is true of audio. Ideally what is needed is a balanced system, though minimising expenditure on the way to an endgame system inevitably means at times some of the system will be better than others. If good uncurtailed bass is important to you then speakers can easily cost a lot more than other components. Different of you are content to omit or seriously diminish the bottom octave or two.

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Are they quite fat and light grey? If so probably Chord Shawline. Think that’s what they usually recommend.

There are many 5-string double basses around with a C (nominally 32Hz) below the bottom E. (Similarly it is not uncommon to see 5 stribg bass guitars with a low C, or drop-tuned 4-strings.)

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Atc are excellent but to get atc spec down to 30 might be expensive looking at their domestic speaker offerings I.e. scm 50/100, although I’m certain many here will disagree

It’s 31 hz for a 5 string bass.

Thanks to everyone for everything. I didn’t imagine I’d get so many responses and so quickly. It’s all been very interesting, enlightening, and helpful. For now I am going to bed as it is nearly 1am and I’m tired. But I’ll be back!

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Yes - but I don’t know of any speakers that get down that far which are cheap.

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Try some good organ music, it goes quite a bit lower :slight_smile:

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There’s so much more to bass than just Hz. I would rather listen to a small system that gets its limited bandwidth sounding right, than a much larger system and room that gets its wider bandwidth sounding wrong - which in all probability would be more the case.

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Isn’t that an oxymoron? :wink:

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My pmc 2023 go to 29 they cost me 2300gbp, you get second hand around 1000 gbp

Indeed, even expensive speakers :pensive:

There aren’t many speakers that do the 30Hz-60Hz range right.
I nearly gave up when searching for new speakers.

And one not only needs the speakers. The amp has to be pretty capable as well.

And finally without the right room treatment there is no way to get that range somewhat right.

Comparing a pair of headphones (let’s say Sen. HD650 and chord Hugo TT) against a 200K speakers based system, in an untreated room, can be quite an unpleasant surprise :sweat_smile:

EDIT : A 35 Hz frequency has a wave length of roughly 10 meters…

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The right Speakers + source + amplification + room + right way of reproducing acoustic double bass = The Holy Grail.

Of course, it would help if your father had spent a lifetime researching the traps and trepidations and being chased by the Nazi’s.

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On a frequency meter what does 31 Hz max - 48 dB actually mean?