Yes!
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Given Naim’s new price for a Hicap DR upgrade (with service included even if you don’t need it) you would probably find it quite a lot cheaper to sell the Hicap and buy a DR version.
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Quite possibly, it also depends on an assumption @haimsh lives in the UK and it’s cost effective to upgrade his existing HiCap. I’ll admit I don’t know what it costs to DR one but probably not an insignificant amount.
Question being though could he sell what he has for a decent price and could he buy a replacement DR one for sensible money.
You’re right though, probably best approach is just finding a DR replacement!
Yes, you are right…
I live in Israel. Unfortunately I cannot upgrade in Naim Lab…
I will have to sell my current HiCap and buy a new HiCap DR. The cost of replacement would be around 700 GBP,
Does it worth it?
Will I hear a substantial difference?
That sounds like a decent price, the used prices depend a lot on the age of the unit. Taking the new price as a baseline and working down from there the older you go!
I’d say a sweet spot on a used unit is one between 2-6 years old balancing between cost and where it sits in its service cycle, ideally you’d expect to have it serviced and if needed recapped once it goes beyond 10 years old, it won’t just stop working after 10 years of course but it will degrade over time by nature of the wear cycles in the components that go in to these power supplies.
The HiCap was revised to incorporate the DR technology in 2012 so anything with a serial number more recent than 2012 should have been made as new as a DR unit.
Sometimes you’ll see an older one that is DR enabled, that is a pre 2012 unit that has been serviced/upgraded. You can tell those easily enough by the Serial number and the fact the DR marking on the back is a second smaller sticker on top of the main sticker.
If you can find one manufactured from 2014-2018 you should be able to get that for £700-1000 as a guide.
Hi Mr.M
I have now an opportunity in Israel to replace my current non-DR HiCap with new HiCap DR. Cost would be around 700GBP. I have the budget for that…
My question is : Does is worth it? Will I hear a substantial improvement if I do it?
I think your ears are the best judge of the value, typically moving from a non DR to a DR version of the same PSU will give a positive overall improvement.
As you have a Supernait 3 which is itself DR enabled and now has those benefits on the power amp stage as well as the Preamp stage you should hear the difference right away. In fact mixing non DR and DR enabled hardware is generally not recommended and can create a negative result!
I would encourage you first before you do anything to listen to your NAIT without a PSU connected and driven off its own internal PSU. Leave it like that for a few days and listen to a range of music, push it a bit if you can with some complex pieces or some detailed classical.
After a few days, add the HiCap back in and see what you think, for the SN3 I’d certainly stick to a DR HiCap, adding one to a SN typically opens up the soundstage a little and adds control and tightness to the lower frequencies.
I
Thanks a lot.
I already did this exercise you recommend and I found out that adding the Non-DR HiCAP improved soundstage.
I understand now from you that if I do it with HiCAP DR, improvement will be much higher.
As the SN3 includes a DR supply for the preamp, I suspect that you will find an improvement if your remove the non DR Hicap completely. Many people find the SN to sound more enjoyable without an additional power supply.
Yes agreed with HH on this, hence the suggestion to run it for a bit without an external PSU.
The HiCap is handling the power specifically to the Preamp stage and allowing the internal PSU to focus on the draw from the power amp.
In fact the basis of my starting this thread was to gauge what others found moving from a SN2 to a SN3 and how it compared with respect to an external PSU.
I’d certainly expect it to open up the soundstage and in my own evaluations found it mostly added control to the bottom end and tightened up the bass compared to running it without an external PSU.
If you can find a fairly recent HiCap to replace the older non DR one I’d expect that to drop the noise floor again and just give a little more of what you’ve already experienced with your existing HiCap.
It won’t be a dramatic change, it’ll be subtle and ultimately your system is a personal journey, as an example I tried a Super Lumina IC recently comparing it to a Hi-Line (which I currently use) I found that really opened up the soundstage and gave it more musicality.
Do come back and report your own findings, like others, I’m always happy to share my own findings and experiences!
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The simple answer is to trust your ears. The Hicap has a much better dedicated supply which should both improve the pre-amp performance and free-up the internal PS so it can just supply the power amp. A DR unit will be even more effective.
DR’ing an existing unit will effectively mean the Hicap is ‘as new’ and will thus also be extending it’s effective working life. Alternatively trading to a newer DR unit should mean that you have a better unit which will also last longer before needing a service.
Is it true…a HiCap DR will free up transformer power resources for the power stage in the SN2 or SN 3 ?
I thought the pre and power were independent sections completely.
A valid point, lets put it to the wider community and see what comes back, one for the Forum Moderators to give an absolute answer to perhaps!
My understanding of the principle of moving the power source away from the amplifier is that it reduces noise first and foremost and in the case of the NAIT will mean the internal toroidal power supply will have less work to do as it’s only having to provide power internally to the power amp section. Adding a HiCap is not adding more power to the Preamp Section, it’s replacing the power source otherwise provided by the internal power supply.
The internal power supply does have separate windings for the different subsystems that require power including the preamp section, power amp section, internal fascia lighting and the motor on the volume and balance pots.
What I do know from having added a HiCap DR to both a SN1 and a SN2 (and as of next week a SN3, woohoo!) is that it gives better grip and timing on the bottom end and opens up the soundstage a little, overall giving a better sense of control and timing accuracy and improving the balance and separation between elements of the recording being output from the amp and onwards to the speakers.
I did also find that where the HiCap was located relative to the NAIT made slight differences to the end result as does the arrangement of the SNAIC’s between the NAIT and the HiCap. Thankfully the SN’s are overall quite forgiving and tolerant in terms of how they are setup and racked in a system as well as giving a modest box count with impressive results, it’s partly why I’ve ended up sticking with a SN based system as having gone towards a higher box count system in the past, and achieved improvements, I found I had a limit to both my patience and willingness to tinker with the system to reach a level of enjoyment beyond which the need to tweak got in the way of actually just pressing play and enjoying what I had!
I expect the same to play out as I now move to a SN3 based setup, I’m keeping my existing HiCap DR and ND5 XS 2 but intend to evolve the system in the short to mid term to incorporate a NDX 2 and eventually to power that from a XPS DR as well as moving from a Hi-Line to a Super Lumina IC.
I also made a decision to take an opportunity with a good trade in deal to move to a full fat Fraim rack as a basis for evolving the system to a higher spec source.
I’ll also then have the means to put a spare turntable on the top of the rack for occasional use and to dip in and out of my vinyl collection more readily as this system is in my home office whereas my vinyl listening setup is in another room which means I tend to only get to it late in the day and with young children have to limit my enjoyment somewhat!
AFAIK the transformer in the Hicap has greater capacity than the pre-amp windings in the SN.
I would expect the transformer to have separate windings for the pre and power sections of the amp.
When a hicap is added it powers the supernait pre and disconnects the internal preamp windings in transformer. The transformer capacity for the power amp stays the same so would give no extra power.
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Seems like a reasonable enough explanation. 
So the point about a HiCap DR directly benefiting the power amp section isn’t true
But that alone does not validate your point about benefits to the power amp section of the SN2 or SN3 by adding a HiCap DR
The power section amplifies the signal it is fed by the pre. If adding a hicap improves the signal from the pre then then it is this higher quality signal which the power section is now amplifying out through the speakers.
I can’t see how adding a hicap makes the amp better suited to drive speakers which are a difficult load as there is no change to the power amp section.
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A standard SN share power between pre and amp. adding a Hicap give the pre its own power and the amp its own similar to a separate pre and amp setup. That will give the SN more headroom as I understand it.