Target audience for the new classic range

Let’s face it, if you want to enjoy sweet music through Naim’s new classic range, well the price of entry is totally out of reach for most people.

Forget Chrome bumper, Olive or Classic range if you think you can get away with that because price of servicing had also gone crazy. As far as I can see, the target audience for the new separated components directly target folks earning a quarter of a million $£ a year. I just don’t think that was JV’s vision of a future.

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It’s a good thing that the new classic 200 series isn’t Naim’s entry level!

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At some point, we have to accept our past, and then get beyond it.

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I’m looking at U.K. prices, and the entry level NSC222/NAP250 is £11,400, add the NPX300 and you get to £17,100. I’m not sure you need to earn a quarter million a year to buy that. The current Classic entry level is NDX2/282/HiCap/250DR at £17,400.

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Wise words Christopher…

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At these prices likely beyond naim…

Looking at the median price of housing + income taxes + food + car + insurances + everything else, there is a good chance that you couldn’t even afford a basic Nait5si…

As of now it is the entry level, fancy all in one boxes are a different type of product all together, hopefully a substitute for the 100 or XS series is in the works.

I’m curious, so the income needed now for a basic standard of living in the U.K. is £250,000? Not that I ever earned anywhere near that, but clearly retiring early a few years ago must have been a terrible mistake as I will head rapidly into penury living on an age-reduced company pension.

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Eoink, I am talking from a Canadian perspective. Median income = $60,000, median house cost = $735,000.

How can you buy new Naim Classic separates in 2023 if you are not an old fart like me who had time to settle the mortgage and all… Thinking about younger working folks who need to get up early for a living! You know the ones who listen to AC/DC at 11 on the volume dial.

Thanks for explaining, I didn’t know where you were based, so I made it clear in my reply I was discussing U.K. prices. (I did try to check your profile to see if it had your location as your numbers made no sense in the U.K., but it’s not public.) The similar thread on Australian/New Zealand prices made it clear in the title that was what the thread was about, which makes the conversation easier.

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I don’t think so. Uniti is the entry level, could be said Mu-So is. I don’t think the 200 series is positioned or should be considered entry level. It is the first of the new generation of separates, sure. Borrowing on aesthetics and tech from the existing product line (uniti, mu-so, statement).

You put £ in your OP, so I assume your comment applies to the UK.

Are you seriously suggesting that anyone earning, say, £200k per year or less in the UK cannot afford a system based on the New Classic range? If so, I simply don’t believe that. They may choose not to, it is after all a discretionary purchase and a significant sum and Naim have increased prices well ahead of general inflation, but so have many other hifi manufacturers along with those in lots of different sectors, cars for example and travel. (For reference: average UK house price in 2023 was just under £300k and is now falling. The median value will be smaller.)

And as for JV’s vision and earlier Naim pricing, throughout most of my working life Naim separates were beyond my financial resources. Statement and a full 555 series system remain so. I buy what I can comfortably afford and get enormous pleasure from it. I think there are far more people in that position than those earning £250k+.

Roger

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Unity is a separate range of products, one which naim refers to as the family of all-in-one players, this is not even a matter of opinion.

You do realize that the median income does not buy the median house, right?

Yes, Uniti is the entry level Naim product line. Are we disagreeing or agreeing?

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Well I meant entry level separates, so I guess we are not in disagreement after all.

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I think that may be pushing it a bit, that’s really mid-level classic! :wink: … 252/300 being top.

Mark

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Yeah, SN3 is entry level Classic.

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I think it’s worth looking at some old pricing information in this context.

In 1988:
NAC32-5 £454.25
HICAP: £425.50
NAP250: £1098.25

UK inflation since 1988 350%

NAC202: £1999
HICAP: £1599
NAP250: £4299 (DR) The new NAP250 is a big jump though at £5700

In fairness I don’t think those (current range) prices are so far out of line with inflation. At my income level Naim has always been aspirational or out of my reach in truth - hence I had to buy most of my system secondhand. The problem I have is that my income doesn’t seem to have ever risen enough to make Naim new a comfortable purchase. That’s not naim’s fault though - I blame that on a mid-life career change I guess!

Salary 1992 £11600 (Year 1 Grad trainee)
Salary 2023 £55000

So in 1992 a Naim classic amplifier combo would have cost around 20% of my gross salary
In 2022 a Naim classic amplifier combo would cost around 15% of my gross salary

Both are a much bigger chunk of net salary of course which is the one that really matters! I suspect to comfortably afford Naim you really do need to have a household income of above £100k nowadays. It probably always has been hi-fi for barristers and Doctors and bankers and self employed business people with all the tax advantages that conveys.

The big issue is with the new NAP250 pricing of £5700, that’s starting to feel like a big jump from the £4299 of a NAP250DR. I’m sure it’s a better amp but it’s still quite a jump. I really hope that Naim don’t follow Linn down the route of crazy price rises. As an example in 1990 ish Linn launched the Akito for (if memory serves) about £149. An Akito today will set you back £1399!! An LP12 was (again if memory serves) about £595 in 1988 ish plus either £149 for an Akito or £399 for an Ittock or an Ekos for £895 - the Ekos is now about £4800. Today an LP12/Ekos would likely leave no change from £10k. whereas

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