The Grand Cafe

I don’t doubt it, and more power to their elbows. And that is what equality of opportunity can achieve. But it isn’t, I expect, a consequence of equality of outcome.

When I was working in Stockholm for that telco company, there was a construction site next to the building I was working in. I guess about 30% of the builders were Swedish ladies.

No it’s a deliberate policy that brings in these changes. Lend Lease one of our biggest builders have a goal of 50/50 by 2025.

OK. Well, I think that is the wrong way round. It can lead to discrimination against men. And against women. Suppose there are 100 men wanting to work in construction and 50 women wanting to work in construction and there is room for 100 workers. That would mean that all the women would get a job, irrespective of their ability to do the job , and 50 of the men would not - again, irrespective of their abilities.
As I say, it is much easier to have a policy of equality of outcome, which is probably why that is what is pursued. It is not necessarily the best way of doing it.
https://youtu.be/KQzA-XRhIhE is a long video where Jordan Peterson (with whom I disagree on many things) talks about equality of opportunity vs equality of outcome. It is very interesting.
(shorter video on this https://youtu.be/EvDrHUQH1UE, but it is a little short and doesn’t explore the issue very deeply).
Basically, if you go for equality of opportunity then what happens is that differences in interests and preferences are maximised (as has happened in Scandinavian countries) and you don’t necessarily get equality of outcome - but with equality of opportunity you increase freedom of choice. And you get the most suitable people in the various jobs.

At least it is not the breeding season, so no eggs/chicks in nest

Yes, I am dead against “positive discrimination”. Equality absolutely, and anything other than equality of opportunity is inexcusable.

In some ways it would be good to have blind interviews, with voice-altering sound to disguise gender - but a prime part of interview is body language, in part assessing whether the person is telling the truth, and whether they will fit with the team, and clarity of communication.

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Yes indeed - which is why it is so hard to legislate for equality of opportunity. It needs a societal change, though, rather than a legislative change.

Ok so this might have cropped up before but in over 50 years of buying hi fi I have never been served by a female once. In the last 2 years I have had countless demos of different pieces of equipment at different Naim dealers and every time the shop has been staffed by men. Is that unusual?

In contrast whenever I have been in an Apple shop it’s been about 50/50

A photo I found on the web showing Herbert Karajan’s car:

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Oh I had a model of one of these on my brother’s slot car track

I later, (very much later), owned a 1986, 3.2 Carrera Sport Coupe in Grandprix White, probably the most interesting car I ever owned, both from a construction and driving point of view.

Didnt get much use!

I often wonder what went wrong at Porsche. I so much more like the old models.

Local Naim shop is all male. Local camera shop seems to be more evenly split - possibly more women. And very good they are too.

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They made them safe!

I have driven a few newer ones and they have such good road holding like they are attached to the road by magnets I felt there was little to learn about the feel of the car at legal speeds.

Even on the track the road holding and the brakes of the newer cars will take relentless hard breaking that would not be possible in the classic cars, especially those from the 60’s and 70’s.

My idea of desirable handling is a car that holds the road like its painted on it, simply going wherever I point it regardless of speed and conditions, and slows/stops as fast as I press the pedal, regardless of conditions. Everything I heard about old Porsches put me off ever wanting one! Aside from that, the 911 style is too much like a VW Beetle, which I never liked. The 928 was the only Porsche I liked the look of.

Seems our friend the pidgin wasn’t a refugee after all. It’s news from the future, 15/1/2021.

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I agree, especially accounting for raising families and the different mother/father dynamics involved in that.

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Yep, once we figure out how men can conceive and develop an instinct for looking after babies, then and only then can we start a sensible discussion on gender equality, unless …

… we start a discussion about farming babies, in which case gender equality is back on the table.

However, some ladies don’t want or can’t have babies. If that is their situation then they must have equality of opportunity. And with that goes equal pay and conditions for equal performance etc etc.

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I think everyone should have an equal start in life regardless of gender religion etc. women can’t even get equal pay for equal work so how’s that “equal”.

" Thank you for sticking around and contributing to our community. We couldn’t do it without you. "

I’ve just been “awarded” the Anniversary Badge. I needed to have made no more than a single contribution during the entire year !!!

The above “citation” is about as insulting as it could possibly have been.

I seriously hope i’m not alone in receiving this insult.

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Think I got one of them a while back, there’s lot of funny badges now you’ve got another.